Zinac Posted July 9, 2009 Posted July 9, 2009 Rachel vs Jin Punishes Blocked 623C Shoryu: 6B > ground combo (note: Jin's C shoryu is in counter state for the hole move. You can easily punish on block) 214A (ice car, 1 hit) > 623C Shoryu: Instant Block ice car hit > 5B > ground combo (note: It'll stuff the shoryu. Its actually safer just to block the shoryu then punish) 214C (ice car, 2 hits): Block first hit, Instant Block the second > 5B > ground combo
RoyalSpade Posted July 12, 2009 Posted July 12, 2009 For jin's ice car. I usually either 6A or 236A it, but sometimes im not fast enough and have to block it. What's the best way to punish ice car after block? I usually just go into 3CD but im sure theres something better after blocking the stupid cart.
Spirit Juice Posted July 12, 2009 Posted July 12, 2009 If it's the B or C versions of the ice car, just IB the second hit with 5B into the combo of your choice.
Coinage Posted July 13, 2009 Posted July 13, 2009 I noticed that a well predicted ice car, you can counter regular A. I did this many times in training. His ice sword he throws can be negated with 236 A,B and C depending on distant.
sogos Posted July 13, 2009 Posted July 13, 2009 instead of trying to hit a straight flying projectile of variable speed with your slow arcing one, you can just omfg block/jump over them crazy, i know.
Coinage Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 instead of trying to hit a straight flying projectile of variable speed with your slow arcing one, you can just omfg block/jump over them crazy, i know. lol very true. Actually I practiced Instant Block on ice cars and it proves to be quite good!!!! I been more educated fighting a good Jin player. I noticed many of his attacks out beat yours and will most likely will always. Somethings I noticed not to do. 1. 214 A if he is rushing in or is about to. 2. Being cornered 3. Of course short range attacks Rachel must be super patient and counter with 6B and follow-up from there. Does anyone else have pointers as well?
ilikeusingdizzy Posted July 25, 2009 Posted July 25, 2009 what about the use of of 214b? say you already have it out,wouldnt it defeat the ice car?or his other projectiles for that matter? i havent practiced it yet could one of you please confirm it for me please?
Kane Posted July 25, 2009 Posted July 25, 2009 Nope, Pumpkin just goes through projectiles, and I don't think I've hit Jin while doing Ice car.
ilikeusingdizzy Posted July 25, 2009 Posted July 25, 2009 well i guess its nice to have out anyway,thanks.
ghaleon109 Posted July 26, 2009 Posted July 26, 2009 I think I'm hearing this wrong... but either way: Pumpkin goes through his projectiles, and it will knock him off his Ice Car. If you have a pumpkin out and you see him start the bigass ice sword that hits like 3 times just wind it into him (taking out the ice sword) and combo afterwards.
Zinac Posted July 26, 2009 Author Posted July 26, 2009 Just to clarify. For each usage of wind pumpkin can nullify Jin's normal projectiles. Pumpkin can also only hit once per use of wind. So if you want to nullify a projectile, run in and still hit/force jin to block pumpkin, you must use another wind. Jin also has a slower moving, larger projectile that will take multiple hits, so trying to nullify it with pumpkin would be a waste of wind. I'm not even sure you can nullify it with pumpkin.
Darcius Posted July 26, 2009 Posted July 26, 2009 Remember not to block icecar from fullscreen, the secret ultimate terrifying setup of death will occur.
ghaleon109 Posted July 26, 2009 Posted July 26, 2009 Just to clarify. For each usage of wind pumpkin can nullify Jin's normal projectiles. Pumpkin can also only hit once per use of wind. So if you want to nullify a projectile, run in and still hit/force jin to block pumpkin, you must use another wind. Jin also has a slower moving, larger projectile that will take multiple hits, so trying to nullify it with pumpkin would be a waste of wind. I'm not even sure you can nullify it with pumpkin. Right, I wasn't really being all that clear.. The bigass multi-hit ice sword (3 hits I belive) shouldn't be completely nulified by the pumpkin. I meant that if you have a pumpkin out and you see him start up that sword you can wind the pumpkin into him (because the startup is VERY long) which stops the sword from coming out (if you try to run up and hit him during the startup you'll just trade counter-hits) Using the pumpkin in front of you nets you a CH on him, which gets rid of the sword and opens him up for a combo.
kro_ Posted July 26, 2009 Posted July 26, 2009 I like to 6a Jin's 1-hit projectiles just to piss him off. It does have a use though. It lets you keep out your pumpkin and stay grounded the entire time to regen wind.
Abaddon Posted July 29, 2009 Posted July 29, 2009 I have alot of trouble with good Jin's. I find zoning difficult since he can get in so fast and punish lobs with ice car. But when I try to fish for 6B CH or rush from the air with j2C combo starters, he can easily stuff any rushes with his 5D. Does that mean I have to start EVERY rushdown attempt with a pumpkin? Do you try to maintain zoning against Jin, if so what range?
Abaddon Posted July 30, 2009 Posted July 30, 2009 Nevermind, I think I figured out how to zone alot better against him. Just gotta keep pumpkin out, try to stay grounded most of the time and make sure I don't waste any precious wind...
iKotomi Posted August 2, 2009 Posted August 2, 2009 Is there info on what the minimum stun of Jin's freeze moves are? I find that a lot of the times I shake to much and get hit because my stick is in the forward position rather than blocking.
ant12292 Posted August 2, 2009 Posted August 2, 2009 http://s1.zetaboards.com/blazblue/pages/jin_data/
Coinage Posted August 8, 2009 Posted August 8, 2009 2C helps on ice cars for his projectiles, lobelias help alot One thing I learned that if your being pressured and he decides to jump, 6A helps. If he decides to stay on the ground, 236A,6B, or 3C works. I noticed there are times during his pressure that you can pull out certain moves. I will give more on that when I play jin again. Since certain players like to space and Spam D with Jin, its good to put out pumpkin and punish if you can see it. I'm not too sure about his DP B and C. I can only say block unless someone else knows what to do with this.
Skye Posted August 8, 2009 Posted August 8, 2009 Aggressive, non nooby Jins > Rachel Put up a defense, punish his laggy specials, especially aerials. Frog.
Xtra_Zero Posted August 14, 2009 Posted August 14, 2009 This match is driving me absolutely nuts. It's the aggressive, smart Jin players that I'm having serious trouble with. Almost every opening I get I had to guess right even before he did the move, and that includes from across the screen! For example, 6A beats his j.B, but in order to actually hit it you have to psychic him before he air dashes. I swear I'm liking B, C, and D icecar more and more because it actually guarantees I'll land something! Also having problems getting stuck in the corner with Jin spamming DP until I do something, and when I try to punish one, the next one comes out and then I get counter hit. Lockdown is TIGHT in the corner, no room for much of anything really. I've resorted to trying out Cat Chair lately, as it is just about the only thing I haven't tried. Doesn't even come out fast enough to block the attacks, even when there's obviously room to stop blocking. Cat chair works ok as an anti-air because it's faster than 6A, but hell if I know what to do after it lands. Pumpkin maybe?
Skye Posted August 14, 2009 Posted August 14, 2009 The cat chair is more of a "gtfo" move than it is a combo starter.
ant12292 Posted August 14, 2009 Posted August 14, 2009 You can 2D after the cat chair to air combo on counter hit, but you really shouldn't be using it as an anti-air. 6A is actually 10 frames quicker than the cat chair and goes through Jin's ice swords projectiles. Imo trying to always have a pumpkin out in this matchup helps a lot to stop Jin's from rushing you down. If he tries to dash in behind a projetile and you have a pumpkin out 236B + 6D.
Xtra_Zero Posted August 14, 2009 Posted August 14, 2009 Actually, I think Cat chair is faster as a reaction type move because it's not very important when the active frames start, what's important is when the guard point frames start. If the guard point gets hit and the opponent is doing anything other than maybe j.A, they're going to eat it pretty much guaranteed. Cat chair is faster in that respect (5f startup vs 7f startup) and also has a much longer guard point duration over the whole character instead of just the upper half. Meaning it's better on reaction to Jin's jump-ins which are more likely to trade with 6A. (Jin j.b range = ARRRRRRRGHHHHH)
kro_ Posted August 14, 2009 Posted August 14, 2009 It's a difficult matchup. You can't rush him wildly due to threat of his DP. You can't zone him forever because his ice wave super (and to a lesser extent ice car) can catch you from across the screen. And you can't rely on 6a to bail you out of anti-air situations due to the stupid range on his j.b and the threat of his air projectiles. His normals outrange yours easily and most of them are jc-able. His ability to do simple frame traps and cover a lot of oki options with 5b over and over is frustrating. His 5c > 5d will eat all of your attempts to backdash or jump out of pressure. Mashing out of ice can be mentally taxing, and he can take advantage of this by going for resets. Finally, his ability to spam D ice car over and over to corner you due to Rachel's massive grounded hitbox will piss you off. But Rachel is Rachel. He is just as afraid of you as you are of him. Pay attention to his heat gauge. If he has less than 50, you can zone him more effectively and he can't do DP > RC as a get out of jail free card. If he has less than 25, he can't bait your 6a with j.236d projectiles. Use that to your advantage. Bait his DPs with careful rushdown and punish with 6b, prevent him from gaining meter with strong zoning, and learn to become psychic with your 6a's. There is no easy way about it. You have to outsmart him consistently while maintaining your momentum. Strong oki, zoning, and combos that end in knockdown are very important in doing so.
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