[CS] Beginner Mechanics (The more you know!)

[Kain]

You can't OS throw tech in CS. You'll be throw countered.

Last I checked, you can---the OS throw break was shortened to 5 frames rather than 11 in CS, so you have to be right on the money to make it work.

And when you say some characters use barrier in their combos, don't you mean 'burst'?

Cause otherwise I don't see how Barrier can be used in combos.

To the guy who asked about counters, I don't think there are any counters to OS throw break, except maybe baiting the throw break. It's more of an instinct thing, honestly.

[BearsAreScary]

I've looked all around the different system mechanics threads, and couldn't find an answer, so here is my nooby question:

Are there frames where you cannot block upon jumping and landing? And are those frames affected by if you're barrier blocking or not?

I barrier block in the air a lot, and as I land, I get hit by rushdown tactics (NOT getting mixed up), and so I feel there must be some frames when landing (and jumping) where you cannot block.

I know you can't barrier within some X frames of jumping, but I'm talking about blocking at all.

[Brother Mojo]

Jump startup takes a few frames, and during that time you're still on the ground and thus for blocking purposes you need to appropriately block high or low. However, since you're pressing "up" to start jumping, you obviously aren't pressing "down + back" and thus are vulnerable to low attacks.

There shouldn't be anything happening when you land, though, unless you're not appropriately pressing either back or down + back by the time you reach the ground.

[DoomieJ]

I really think you should add a section to this guide about the different techs in the game. Would really be helpful to a lot of new players who are unaccustomed to the whole ability to tech. Or maybe someone who is better at BB should write up a guide to teching/techpunishes/techtraps.

[mooyang90]

Or maybe someone who is better at BB should write up a guide to teching/techpunishes/techtraps.

But when/how to tech and techpunishes/tech traps are all character specific though. You would in a sense have to write 13 guides.

[madaxe_munkee]

This is actually more of a CT question, but I'm gonna ask it here because it comes with a corresponding CS question:

Under what circumstances will blocking a burst put you under guard break? Does this still happen in CS?

I've done it, and had my guard broken as well a few times, but I couldn't figure out any common features in any of the cases :/

[Kain]

Offensive Bursting (gold burst, done when you're in neutral and you burst) breaks guard on block and destroys barrier.

I think you can prevent guard-breaking by IBing the burst, but there's a reason why I never use my barrier in most matches, that being 100% barrier=faster burst.

As for this happening in CS, I'm not sure, but I think offensive burst in CS doesn't break guard. Someone better knowledgeable about CS mechanics can answer this question better than I can.

[Justice7541]

Jump startup takes a few frames, and during that time you're still on the ground and thus for blocking purposes you need to appropriately block high or low. However, since you're pressing "up" to start jumping, you obviously aren't pressing "down + back" and thus are vulnerable to low attacks.

There shouldn't be anything happening when you land, though, unless you're not appropriately pressing either back or down + back by the time you reach the ground.

Lol, that isn't true. Jump startup is completely vulnerable. You aren't blocking or anything. Go ahead and try to jump out of Noel's 5B > 5C blockstring (in CT). There's a one-frame gap between the two normals on block, so you'll get caught on startup if you try to jump out. Hits mid too, so you can rule out that possibility.

[shtkn]

you are invulnerable to throws during jump startup, but vulnerable to everything else.

[Nodelic2]

I don't know if this is the right place to ask but why is knockdown often so important? Like i understand that it's not right for all situations, but often I read that it's better to go for a knockdown rather than extra damage.

[CakeWasBannedd]

I don't know if this is the right place to ask but why is knockdown often so important? Like i understand that it's not right for all situations, but often I read that it's better to go for a knockdown rather than extra damage.

It's always better to go for knockdown compared to damage. The possibility of getting a reset into another combo depends on the character, how good the knockdown is, etc. Unless the extra damage is higher than ANYTHING you can feasibly get off of knockdown, it's better to go for knockdown.

[Justice7541]

I don't know if this is the right place to ask but why is knockdown often so important? Like i understand that it's not right for all situations, but often I read that it's better to go for a knockdown rather than extra damage.

It really depends on the situation. If you're playing, say, Tager against Hazama, you'll be spending a lot of time and energy just getting close enough to do anything at all to him. Once you do, if it comes down to dealing a couple hundred extra damage and starting over from scratch or sacrificing a bit of damage and staying on top of him, the choice is pretty obvious.

Obviously the choice won't be as pronounced with most characters, but generally you want to keep offensive pressure rather than just letting it reset to neutral game.

[Hi I'm Asylum]

since forever; because without good players, good games wouldn't exist.

Hahahah what

[Brother Mojo]

Lol, that isn't true. Jump startup is completely vulnerable. You aren't blocking or anything. Go ahead and try to jump out of Noel's 5B > 5C blockstring (in CT). There's a one-frame gap between the two normals on block, so you'll get caught on startup if you try to jump out. Hits mid too, so you can rule out that possibility.

Good to know, thanks. I'd thought I was just getting caught by lows but I guess not. How many frames is jump startup, anyway? Or does it vary by character?

[BearsAreScary]

Okay, I tested my unable to block while landing theory, and I guess it got a bit more complex, but as I am still noob as far as system mechanics go....

This may be more of a character-specific question, but I play Arakune. When I summon a cloud around one full hop's worth of distance in the air, I (obviously) like to block as soon as possible afterwards. There are many times when I will try to barrier ASAP, and the barrier will actually come out, but then around when I hit the ground I'll get hit by Ragna's 6A or something while continuing to hold barrier. Is this just me thinking I can't block when I hit the ground but actually I'm just barrier cancelling my cloud without having the ability to block? That certainly doesn't sound right to me, but I guess that's why I'm posting here. I am truly, utterly confused.

[4r5]

Dunno about BB, but in GG and SF, if you jump and don't do any moves, when you land you have recovery where you can only block. I think this is called trip-guard in SF. If you do a move, then you have vulnerable landing recovery, even if you recover in the air and do other stuff.

[Sh0ryu_Repp4]

Knockdown is ALWAYS best. Alot of games with high level players start with footsies trying to score the first knockdown. it's also essential for characters like Akuma/Ibuki who rely on the "Vortex" strategy w/ untechable knockdowns. In the rights hands it's downright deadly.

@4r5 are you referring to an empty jump in? those are mostly used to psyche oppoents out (Sakura's Otoshi (DP+K) w/ no input) VERY HIGH RISK, but can lead to a very high reward.

[flytai45]

i have a question about moves that cant be blocked in the air...are these moves character dependant like the example given (ragnas 6a) or are they grouped like every characters launcher isnt air blockable?

[MashButtons]

They are character dependent, but the majority of characters have some kind of air unblockable.

Off the top of my head, Bang's 5C, Hakumen's 2C, Ragna's 6A, Noel's 6C....

[ZONG_one]

Every character has air unblockables.

They are all different.

One that is VERY common will be 6A. (Rg, Ca, La, No, Ha, Ra)

Also, 6C seems to be somewhat common. (Ba, No, Ts, Ji)

2C is also shared by a few chars. (Li, Ts, Ha, La, Ta)

Every good anti air.

This is off the top of my head, so I know there's more with those inputs alone.

And hella more with other inputs.

[alvare]

When an attack "Prorates 80%" it means that when used as a combo starter, the damage of every attack after it will cause 20% less damage. "Forced Proration" means it will prorate the following hits even in the middle of a combo.

This because 2K is a bitch.

[isuckatgames]

Can someone explain a fatal counter to me? And does it affect the game anyhow? Damage? Combos? Wttf is it

[Eshi]

Can someone explain a fatal counter to me? And does it affect the game anyhow? Damage? Combos? Wttf is it

Fatal Counter is a special kind of counter only attributed to a select few moves. These moves always say fatal counter, never regular counter.

A fatal counter adds additional frames of untechable time to subsequent hits in a combo. Basically, things which wouldn't combo normally WILL combo after a fatal counter, which usually means more damage.

[shtkn]

http://dustloop.com/guides/bbcs/systemGuide/systemGuide.html

find your topic and read up

[Mechmainiac]

Can Tager ever get negative penalty