BB:CS Match-Up Chart

[Jason D.]

When I lose to someone mashing, I blame them. And then I kick their puppy, and conjecture that their mother was a prostitute.

But seriously, I play Rachel, and I beat people who use the Top 3 all the time. A lesser player is still a lesser player. And every now and then, I'll even beat a good player using top tier. Such as DacidBro. *waves*

Regardless of character advantages, if you're getting hit, then you're doing something wrong. Figure out what that is, and stop doing that. Maybe you will have to work harder for the win, but in the end, if you can read your opponent right, then the game is yours. There's never a situation in which there's literally nothing you can do.

[smooshman]

When I lose to someone mashing, I blame them. And then I kick their puppy, and conjecture that their mother was a prostitute.

But seriously, I play Rachel, and I beat people who use the Top 3 all the time. A lesser player is still a lesser player. And every now and then, I'll even beat a good player using top tier. Such as DacidBro. *waves*

Regardless of character advantages, if you're getting hit, then you're doing something wrong. Figure out what that is, and stop doing that. Maybe you will have to work harder for the win, but in the end, if you can read your opponent right, then the game is yours. There's never a situation in which there's literally nothing you can do.

well. there are a few... and your unlikely to get in them..... but if your in them either (severe corner rape, you have a character with no reversals, don't have 50 heat, no burst, no barrier, and a simaltaneous high-low attack by way of a Litchi, and your guard broke.)

A. the other guy is really good.

B. you've failed the round. such as the example.... because it's really hard to get in these situations.

of course that's knit picking.

[Jason D.]

I do have a character with no reversals. But yeah, what most people forget is, there's also this thing called blocking. If there's nothing else you can do to beat someone's move, try that. I guarantee that you won't get hit.

Though yes, to be fair, there are certain unblockable setups. Like the ex-clap loop, and Eddie-esque high-and-low hits. But I can also nitpick my own nitpick and say that when you first got into that setup, then that's the point when you did something wrong.

But anyway, my main point was just that things are never hopeless. There's always something you can do.

[Dacidbro]

I do have a character with no reversals. But yeah, what most people forget is, there's also this thing called blocking. If there's nothing else you can do to beat someone's move, try that. I guarantee that you won't get hit.

Though yes, to be fair, there are certain unblockable setups. Like the ex-clap loop, and Eddie-esque high-and-low hits. But I can also nitpick my own nitpick and say that when you first got into that setup, then that's the point when you did something wrong.

But anyway, my main point was just that things are never hopeless. There's always something you can do.

You are, as always, a hero among very, very small men.

As always, I have a lot of respect for your consistently positive attitude even while using the worst character in the game.

[Irrsinn]

I do have a character with no reversals. But yeah, what most people forget is, there's also this thing called blocking. If there's nothing else you can do to beat someone's move, try that. I guarantee that you won't get hit.

Until you get your guard broken.

[kenja0]

Not as easy in this game to do that- unless you play my character.

[Dacidbro]

You know, Irrsinn, unless you've bursted twice with a 4 primer character, it's usually incredibly easy to avoid. And even if you do get crushed, their combo auto prorates 80% even if they successfully capitalize, which is also shockingly rare.

[ShinsoBEAM]

Regardless of character advantages, if you're getting hit, then you're doing something wrong. Figure out what that is, and stop doing that. Maybe you will have to work harder for the win, but in the end, if you can read your opponent right, then the game is yours. There's never a situation in which there's literally nothing you can do.

This is what I believe, but sometimes your only option is to block and be patient and wait for your chance.

Also situation you can't do anything cursed tager in CT, XD. Your boned unless they get careless get to close and you can hit them with burst, or 6A+B, but they don't need to take that risk.

[Jason D.]

Oy, guard breaking. While I do like the guard primer system for being novel, and for making you have to shift strategies for the guard crush instead of getting it by sheer accident, I do wish they would've put more thought into the primers themselves. "Hey, how many primers should we give Rachel, who has zero reversals and horrible anti-airs? Just four? Cool. And how about Bang and Hakumen, who can get out of pressure with the push of one button? Six? Perfect!" I'm fairly positive that they gave out primers based on who was taller/more muscly, instead of being based on who actually needs them.

But that being said, even with a character with few primers, guard breaking isn't that common. I mean, at the minimum, you have four primers, and then three more chances with a barrier guard. It takes a lot of effort to whittle that down. Unless you're Lambda (Hate you!). Or occasionally a Rachel (Six primers in one blockstring! I want that crown, Lambda.) But yeah, somewhere between 7+ primer hits, you should've found your way out of blocking at some point.

Oh yeah! And if it is going to happen, quick jump and let yourself get guard crushed in the air. That fucks up everyone's punish attempts. Always hilarious.

[A.X.I.S.]

Oh yeah! And if it is going to happen, quick jump and let yourself get guard crushed in the air. That fucks up everyone's punish attempts. Always hilarious.

tagers j.2C.

[Dacidbro]

Yeah people are still trying to figure out how to pick up the aerial guard break. SOME people have it down, but a lot of people are still at "what happened?"

I agree fully with your comment about the primers, the characters that need them the most don't have them, and the ones that don't do. Me getting guard broken happens once every never, assuming I don't defensive burst, and if I DO defensive burst, even twice, they still have to be wizardly in their primer breakings. Bang's too mobile/too guard pointy to get stuck.

[Dacidbro]

... woah

[Spirit Juice]

Sure feels like I took a massive dump in here. (lol 52 posts deleted)

Sorry to all of you that made big, long winded posts or even insightful ones. I couldn't be bothered to read so many pages of pure garbage, so I just deleted everything pertaining to the discussion.

We'll just end the discussion like this: don't get hit. The end.

[kilabeep3]

I, a mediocre player, have already won 3 tournaments. I know several other people who use top tier characters who have also won tournaments. IT HAPPENS, A LOT. Get used to it. It has happened in every fighter where tiers existed. Why do you still complain? If it's that depressing quit.

if you're simply going to sit around and bitch about bang i'd say you have about 3 options. play the game and learn how to fight'em, sit there and bitch, or just say screw it all and quit. option2 wont get you far so you may need to keep a box of kleenex near and learn how to play against him. option3 would be simply sad because you decided to quit because you cant beat bang. granted its your world, and if you the player want to quit then do so. also if you want to bitch i guess go for that if it makes your heart shine. however, know that bang isnt going anywhere and he'll still remain where hes at until a patch or whatever comes along.

so much truth and win!

kensou i really need to hit up PZ with you guys again always a fun time playing you and jason.

is weekly tournies on tuesdays or what?

on topic

just practicing not getting hit is a serious undertaking in itself. because this game is kinda mash friendly so yeah.

its more like learn PERFECT spacing between attacks and learn your setups properly.

i know ive lost matches cause the other guy just knows where to be and when so i cant take control of the match and start my offense.

and as far as i can recall all of the older games before SF4 didnt get patched or any updates after em the final game was the final version you had to play. they manned up and learned the matchup (even if it was fucking impossible to win they did it)

and what did the players do?? they ADAPTED!!!

SF3 3s, ST, and has its problems with the top tier characters.

chun and yun with easy hit confirms into super and GENEI JIN

O sagat ( need i say more?)

so the games still the same but strats and shit get found out over time. its been like 2 yrs since BB first came out, i sure theres shit we still hadn't figured out yet.

and now theres balance updates and such so yeah if arc decides to patch shit they will.

until then just learn it like we all did when we were dealing with the CT tops...

and i find it funny that all the people really bitching about this are CT top tier players that got nerfed in CS.

[A.X.I.S.]

Sure feels like I took a massive dump in here. (lol 52 posts deleted)

Sorry to all of you that made big, long winded posts or even insightful ones. I couldn't be bothered to read so many pages of pure garbage, so I just deleted everything pertaining to the discussion.

We'll just end the discussion like this: don't get hit. The end.

hmm i was hoping you would...say something better than "don't get hit."

oh well this thread needed the juicing.

[AdamNW]

This I am honestly more scared of litchi then I am bang right now.

I agree with this. Litchi was by far my worst matchup in CT for all characters. This is bullshit.

[Skye]

I agree with this. Litchi was by far my worst matchup in CT for all characters. This is bullshit.

I have to agree.

Bang has easy, mash friendly, low risk, high reward, safe OTG pokes.

Litchi has easy, mash friendly, low risk, high reward, long range, fat combo, OTG, oki, corner pressure, mix up, mist cancelling pokes.

Oh yeah.....

[smooshman]

I agree with this. Litchi was by far my worst matchup in CT for all characters. This is bullshit.

so it wasn't just me.

the problem I had was she just put me in lockdown.... except unlike the other characters who could do that, she wasn't terrible a melee. I couldn't attack her, because she just brings the staff back and I'm on defensive for the rest of the match.... then I screw up and eat a long combo, and it's back to square one.... She's the only character I've ever considered turning down a challenge from... that staff just travels around the field and.... and... Q_Q

[MisoSowee]

I'm not too afraid of litchi but that's probably just because how the match-up works. Even in CT Litchi has to play much differently vs haku, and I can only guess it'd be the same way in CS. The mist-canceling does seem pretty icky though, especially if I'm dicking around with subs. (rachel ftw)

On a side note, if anyone can, could somebody briefly outline when midscreen j.C enders will work off of j.2a loop? I've seen quite a few whiffs and I'm wondering if it's char specific or it depends on starter, etc. Same goes for stuff like 3c. Some of the combos just make me O_O they look so odd.

[Spirit Juice]

hmm i was hoping you would...say something better than "don't get hit."

oh well this thread needed the juicing.

That would imply it would've been worth my time, which it wasn't.

[Skye]

Okay, this has been eating me since I saw this list.

Someone explain to me why Arakune has an advantage over Carl and Noel.

[kousaka]

Against Carl, kune has a lot of tools to get out of pressure and run away. IB>backdash, beamsuper, counter assault are all very effective during sandwich pressure. Curse combos hit Carl pretty hard and usually will end in one combo and Carl has limited runaway options during curse.

Similar for Noel, JB can put all sorts of pressure on Noel at certain angles if you super jump. 5D beats out a lot of stuff on oki. Curse combo hits hard on Noel and she has limited options during curse..

That's just my opinion on those matchups. It might be an advantage but only a slight one at best.

[Dacidbro]

Arakune is a lot better than this list puts him, for the record..

If you don't believe me watch more souji.

[Skye]

Souji is great, but I still would like to know his match up information.

The best way I could summarize a tier list was a collection of match ups, with the better characters having the better match ups and vise versa. In just about every tier list, I see him as upper mid tier.

I'd like to know why, and where is all this match up information coming from? God knows it's not from the Arakune forums.

[Zaido]

Arakune is a lot better than this list puts him, for the record..

If you don't believe me watch more souji.

SOUJI is a beast...

Arakune as a character without fever isn't that good.