BBCS2 FINAL SHOWDOWN: Loketest 5, Nov. 15th Discussion

[Skye]

Arakune

What is it with this character having many stuff back?

Annoying~

They probably mean recurse, can't think of anything else.

[HiagoX]

●Λ

重力の削除が痛い反面おいしい技を多数貰いました

特にシックルや6A、Aパルサーはありがたい

割り込みカラミティからコンボに行けるのも○

It hurts to not have her DP anymore. On the other hand, I've learned a lot of nice techniques for her.

Particulary Sickle Storm (236D) and 6A, A Parser is appreciated too.

Not to mention combos that can be started from Calamity (632146D).

[Henaki]

I'm going to assume the super armor is still there.

And IIRC, you can charge 6A and it'll still drag the opponent during the charge? That's what I'm going to assume.

Sounds like 6A is the new CS1 5D, what with the 5D magnetism nerf (which was a required nerf imo).

from what i can tell 6a is exactly like his unlimited version, so yes, it will be godlike.

the most important thing now is if you magnetize someone, you can pretty much pull them into a mixup from half screen.

i see the reason they removed his ability to jump cancel it by the way, because of this, he would be able to potentially pull people from 3/4 screen with absolutely no cahnce of retaliation in some circumstances, then covering the unsafeness of the move with a grab, essentially making sure that almost anyone will no matter what remain at like his 5c range safely. since you can just pink throw people and force a tech, leaving yourself at neutral.

[mAc Chaos]

I'm not concerned. He is top tier until the game comes out and Arakunes figure out some new instant kill combo and Tager ends up on the bottom again.

Tager can never be good. :P

[Cirno]

I turn my back for a bit, and 20 new pages? That was kind of a pain to sift through (especially hakumen.. augh).

Updated the first post again, if anything doesn't look right feel free to bring it to my attention.

[A.X.I.S.]

Magnetize haku-men and pull him 3/4th screen in and get countered.

HYPE

Not even arakune is safe from tager when he does magnetized 6A...best buff ever.

[HiagoX]

●ツバキ

細かいところで色々強化を貰って、細かいところで色々弱くされてる

とはいえやっぱり強くなりました

牽制手段や崩しが増え、ゲージを溜めやすくなったって時点でCSとか鼻で笑っちゃうレベルに

あとはその他の細かい技の使い道の模索になるか

Tsubaki

She received many buffs in small stuff, and she received many nerfs in some little things as well. (?)

But indeed she is stronger than before.

(Someone else translate this one.)

(Something about the usage method of some of her little stuff.)

[mAc Chaos]

Magnetize haku-men and pull him 3/4th screen in and get countered.

HYPE

Not even arakune is safe from tager when he does magnetized 6A...best buff ever.

I LOL'd when I countered you out of one of your Gadget RC ricks. :P Nothing is safe!

[Eshi]

Oi Haigo, Makoto stuff plz.

The other chars have gotten their share of info, translate the ones who haven't gotten any yet.

I asked jewdo smash to translate for me before he went off to work. It basically says that a lot of the things makoto could do has been taken away so she's more boring to play, but she probably did too much damage and she can still get high damage in the corner.

[HiagoX]

ハザマ

CSよりは確実に弱いが、普通に戦える

特に画面端での威圧感はピカイチ。わたくし普通に5000オーバーのコンボ貰っちゃいましてね…へへ…

A派生強化でDががピュッピュって感じで打てるのがいい感じ

Hazama is certainly not as strong as he was in CS, but he can fight just fine.

Particulary, his pressuring in the corner is "pikaichi" (I don't fucking know what that means). The ordinary combos I've got were dealing over 5000 damage (I think he means in the corner?).

(Don't exactly got what he meant, someone else please translate it.)

[Tofu Warrior]

Wait, didn't they give Tager a 6A > 5C gatling a few loke tests back? So now he can pull his opponents in with a charged 6A, and then make it (relatively) safe with 5C. That's dope.

I also suggested in the Tager general discussion thread that the faster recovery on 3C might allow him to do max range 3C, walk forward, 2B xx Collider. That would be a huge buff for him. It would only do about 2000 damage, but you'd be landing it a lot, and that shit adds up.

Edit: And why is Yumura landing more B-Busters? Maybe they gave it 3F start up like Pot Buster?

Edited November 16, 2010 by Tofu Warrior

[HiagoX]

●μ

画面端ツルギからコンボをすこーし伸ばせるか？

3Cからのコンボは死んだが、そこから起き攻めの択は増えた

設置も隙減ったし立ち回り殺すキャラかしら

Mu

Maybe her Furu no Tsurugi corner combos can be extended a little more?

Her 3C combos are not possible anymore, but her oki options after it increased.

(Don't know if my translation would be correct, please someone else translate it).

●マコト

ロケテからは変更点あんまないのでCSと比較すると

色々やれることとられたって感じの調整でちょっとつまらないかな？

まあ前が色々できすぎたってのはあるけど

しかし画面端では色々バウンドする技とかあるんで画面端なら火力最強なんじゃないでしょうか

ロマンだね

Makoto

She wasn't much changed from the last loketest, but in comparison to CS she was, and many of the stuff she could do before was adjusted making her seem kinda.. boring?

Well, she could do a lot of stuff before.

However, she does have many bouncing techniques in the corner, and her damage output in the corner remains the strongest, right?

[mAc Chaos]

I thought Tager lost a gatling... I don't remember what it was though.

[HiagoX]

●ヴァルケン

都落ち

2Cが使いづらくなり、狼変身崩しも微妙、火力も少し下がってこれから伸びそうもない

とヒマくんが憂いてました

よくて中堅になったらいいなーとのこと

ふむ

Valkenhayn

(Some joke about him, rofl)

2C will be hard to use, it should be more difficult to use Wolf Form as well. His damage output has been reduced.

Hima-kun seems to be sad about it.

(Err, if he's down to mid tier, that should be fine? Not sure if that's what it's said).

And regarding Hakumen, I made a mistake: It seems his damage output has been reduced, and not powered up.

[KayEff]

●Ragna

まだお後暴れたらなんか潰せた

ロケテ中は念仏唱えるキャラ化してるかも…

本稼働で色々増えるといいですね

You can fit something after 22C if you mash something out. (nothing new)

I prayed during the loketest that this character would change...

It's a good thing that there are quite a bit of working machines around here (someone verify what "本稼働" means)

●Jin

やること全く変わってないのでロケテじゃ強いです

けど本稼働して他のキャラが煮詰まってくると落ちてきそうな感はある

テツさんが50連勝してわろた

It seems that Jin did not get any changes, meaning he's strong in the loketest.

But it really boils down to everything else getting worse.

Tetsu has a 50 win-streak ()

●Noel

この人もロケテ中のやることは変わってないですね

牽制で少しだけ牽制弱くなったらしいけどCSよりは全然強いしいいんじゃないですか

どうでも

This person as well didn't get any changes in this loketest.

She's only a little not terrible ("a little buffed" probably) but coming from CS she's still nowhere near powerful.

Whatever.

●Rachel

まさかCSよりダメージ効率悪くなるとは誰が想像したであろうか…

呉羽さんが頑張ってたけど面白い動きはしてた

JA確かに強いけどダメージカスで風もなくなるし色々きついかもしれん

ダリアさんで風稼ぐとかも出来るみたいだけどゲージ使うしねぇ…

It's possible that Rachel's damage output is still poor, who would've thought...

Kureha-san is still going to try (probably on using Rachel) but it's interesting how it moves (someone verify on this sentence)

Surely j.A is strong but the wind won't become useful; it's going to be difficult in many ways.

Dahlia-san will kind of be able to earn some wind but the gauge won't be used

(this paragraph alone is a little difficult; someone verify that the information here is correct)

●Taokaka

絶滅危惧種

現地にいたタオ使いの人は絶望のまなこをしておった…

見てる限りでは3C後相手がかなり吹っ飛んで猫1でも追撃行けてなかった

ENDANGERED SPECIES

Where I was, there was pretty much despair in the eyes of Taokaka players...(Hiago)

From what I can see, 3C "blows off" the opponent quite a bit (launches?) and Cat Spirit 1 is not good at pursuit (I'm confused as you are on this, but I'm guessing Cat Spirit 1 cannot link from 3C). (KayEff)

●Tager (done by Hiago and KayEff)

ぎゃくしゅうが　はじまる

今までのテイガーより段違いに強くなったっぽい

ゆーむらさんが笑いながら割りまくってBドラ決める様はかっこよかったです

有名勢も口を揃えて「テイガーカスだろ…」と言うほど

不利キャラはもちろんいるけど6Aのお蔭で荒らし能力がかなり強化されました

3on3の先方はテイガーで決まり

Counterattack begins.

Until now, Tager has shown a really wide difference from what he was before.

Yuumura-san was laughing at the number of people ragequitting after being defeated with a B Driver, which was a really impressive amount of people.

The famous energy and opening (huh?) are ready with "This is Tager Custom (Combo? also, I'm making an educated guess that 'カス' is custom, but I actually don't know, someone verify)," so they say.

The disadvantaged character that Tager was is still here, but his new 6A made his approaching so much stronger.

The people of the 3on3 are determined for Tager. (Hiago, edited by KayEff for questionable accuracy)

●Arakune (done by Hiago)

なんだよこのキャラ色々もとに戻ってんじゃねーか

めんどくせー

What is it with this character having many stuff back?

Annoying~

●Litchi (done by KayEff)

既に仕上がっているきむらいちにぼこぼこにされました

このキャラは今回も戦えますね、棒飛ばしのうさんくさい判定が邪魔邪魔

CH限定だけど2C＞一通が復活してしまいました＾＾

Before, I was finished (his comments probably), and Kimura-tchi (probably just Kimura, the Litchi player) found it incomplete (someone verify on this sentence).

This time, this character is fighting (I don't know what this means), the flying stick's suspicious "判定" (dictionary says "judgment" which makes no fucking sense to me) is in the way

Even though it's only to CH, 2C > itsuue is alive ^^ (meaning CH 2C > itsuue works probably)

●Bang

よくわからない

I don't really know.

●Carl (done by KayEff)

自分のキャラなので色々わかります

姉が死にやすく、反面本体一人でコンボを伸ばしやすくなってたり、姉の中継がしやすくなった所を見ると今回のカルルのコンセプトは

「カルルで出来るだけコンボを稼いで、姉さんを中継程度に使ってね☆」

ってことなんだろうなと思う

姉さんまじで死にやすいから壁として使いにくくなったのは残念

ただ補正切りは色々増えそうだから楽しそうではある

それが出来る前に死んじゃいそうだけどね！ねえさん！

I know lots about my character.

NEE-SAN doesn't die as easily, on the other hand it's not easy to combo with one person, NEE-SAN's relay (maybe movement while D is held?) is not easy. The point I can see is the concept with Carl (maybe the sentence is supposed to be rearranged, could possibly be "This is concept with Carl as far as I know").

Since NEE-SAN dies unbelievably easily, it's too bad we can't use her as a barrier (someone verify this sentence).

That's all I could do with the death! NEE-SAN! (First part needs verification)

●Hakumen (done by Hiago)

立ち回りで強くなった感？

そのかわり火力が下がってたのは分かった

またカルルに対してめんどくさい調整してきたなぁ…

It feels like fighting using him is kinda harder? (KayEff's notes - It appears Hakumen's "tachimawari" game got worse. More on "tachimawari:" http://meh.brpxqzme.net/himff/conduct.html)

In exchange, I could understand that his damage output has increased.

Again, his adjusts made the matchup look bad for Carl, eh... (KayEff's notes - probably is going to be hard to adjust to Hakumen vs. Carl matchup)

●Λ (done by Hiago)

重力の削除が痛い反面おいしい技を多数貰いました

特にシックルや6A、Aパルサーはありがたい

割り込みカラミティからコンボに行けるのも○

It hurts to not have her DP anymore. On the other hand, I've learned a lot of nice techniques for her.

Particulary Sickle Storm (236D) and 6A, A Parser is appreciated too.

Not to mention combos that can be started from Calamity (632146D).

●Tsubaki (done by Hiago)

細かいところで色々強化を貰って、細かいところで色々弱くされてる

とはいえやっぱり強くなりました

牽制手段や崩しが増え、ゲージを溜めやすくなったって時点でCSとか鼻で笑っちゃうレベルに

あとはその他の細かい技の使い道の模索になるか

She received many buffs in small stuff, and she received many nerfs in some little things as well. (?)

But indeed she is stronger than before.

They made more changes and nerfs (this part needs verification), it's harder to fill up the gauge, and at one point I laughed at how the level was like at CS1. (BAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW)

(Something about the usage method of some of her little stuff.)

●Hazama (done by Hiago)

CSよりは確実に弱いが、普通に戦える

特に画面端での威圧感はピカイチ。わたくし普通に5000オーバーのコンボ貰っちゃいましてね…へへ…

A派生強化でDががピュッピュって感じで打てるのがいい感じ

Hazama is certainly not as strong as he was in CS, but he can fight just fine.

Particulary, his pressuring in the corner is "pikaichi" (It means 'top notch' Hiago, Google is your best frriiieeeennnnddddd - KF). The ordinary combos I've got were dealing over 5000 damage (I think he means in the corner?).

A (from D) underwent buffs, I feel it's like a laser (probably quicker startup) what with hitting the opponent (probably from what he sees, can't explain from here)

●μ (done by Hiago, last line by KayEff)

画面端ツルギからコンボをすこーし伸ばせるか？

3Cからのコンボは死んだが、そこから起き攻めの択は増えた

設置も隙減ったし立ち回り殺すキャラかしら

Maybe her Furu no Tsurugi corner combos can be extended a little more?

Her 3C combos are not possible anymore, but her oki options after it increased.

I wonder with the gaps in her blockstrings (what does "secchi" 設置　mean? I need verification on this) that her "tachimawari" is dead (tachimawari is kind of like a defense bait game; read it up on here: http://meh.brpxqzme.net/himff/conduct.html)

●Makoto (done by Hiago)

ロケテからは変更点あんまないのでCSと比較すると

色々やれることとられたって感じの調整でちょっとつまらないかな？

まあ前が色々できすぎたってのはあるけど

しかし画面端では色々バウンドする技とかあるんで画面端なら火力最強なんじゃないでしょうか

ロマンだね

She wasn't much changed from the last loketest, but in comparison to CS she was, and many of the stuff she could do before was adjusted making her seem kinda.. boring?

Well, she could do a lot of stuff before.

However, she does have many bouncing techniques in the corner, and her damage output in the corner remains the strongest, right?

●Valkenhayn (done by Hiago)

都落ち

2Cが使いづらくなり、狼変身崩しも微妙、火力も少し下がってこれから伸びそうもない

とヒマくんが憂いてました

よくて中堅になったらいいなーとのこと

ふむ

(Some joke about him, rofl)

2C will be hard to use, it should be more difficult to use Wolf Form as well. His damage output has been reduced.

Hima-kun seems to be sad about it.

(Err, if he's down to mid tier, that should be fine? Not sure if that's what it's said).

●Platinum (done by KayEff, biyatch)

ぺろ…

PERO

All compiled into one post. I'd work on the other ones to attest for verification, but I have class. Maybe when I get back home.

Edited November 17, 2010 by KayEff

[Mumm-Ra]

I thought Tager lost a gatling... I don't remember what it was though.

You mean throw doesn't cancel to anything?

[Skye]

Tager lost his 5c > 6a gatling.

[Leo7]

Yes, Tager lost his 5C > 6A gatling. And looking at the overall changes here, I don't see anything about a 6A > 5C gatling.

I'm still iffy on the half screen mix-up that 6A provides (e.g. high low with 6B or 3C without the command grab option), cause it feels unsafe. Can't really tell though without knowing what the frame advantage of all his attacks are now.

[farranpoison]

Makoto, more boring?

Determination to keep maining her... slipping...

Ganbatte, Makoto...! ;_;

Dramatics aside, does that mean that she still has one of the highest corner damage outputs among the cast? Also, just how hard is pulling off her triple D corner combo now that her drive's hitstun has been reduced? Gah, I'd really like to see it in action.

[Lord Knight]

なんだよこのキャラ色々もとに戻ってんじゃねーか

めんどくせー

agreed wholeheartedly

arakune should always suck

but i know he'll have broken shit anyways :/

[HiagoX]

●全体的な評価

強すぎるキャラがいない、みんな何かしら尖った部分を持ってる

と、全体的にみると意外とまとも？

各キャラ細かく見てると調整必死なのもいくつかあるけど

ロケテで目立ってたのはテイガーとジン

特にテイガーは6Aの仕様で稼働初期はだいぶ食えそう

ただテイガー使い多数から「つまらん調整」って言われてたのには笑った

カルルは新作でも楽しそうなのでよかったよかった

プラチナは言うても技はスタンダードだからあんまり伸びしろない気がするんだよね…

まあ使うけど

Not going to translate it all, I'm pretty tired. I'll type out what I've understood after giving it a fast read:

- There are no really scary characters as of now. (Maybe that would mean it's more balanced than before...?)

- He says the top characters at the loketest are Tager and Jin.

- The new Carl looks fun, and he's glad for that.

- Platinum's techniques seems to be really "standard", so he doesn't think she'll be any changed from now.

[Kyosuke Kagami]

>top characters

>Tager and Jin

Oh hello again, ice carz abuse and random genesic emerald tegah bastah in ranked

Of course, I can be wrong and the game may develop differently with the passing of time

[HiagoX]

agreed wholeheartedly

arakune should always suck

but i know he'll have broken shit anyways :/

I know right.

@Kay

Thanks man. :3

[felipebwk]

>top characters

>Tager and Jin

Oh hello again, ice carz abuse and random genesic emerald tegah bastah in ranked

Of course, I can be wrong and the game may develop differently with the passing of time

I pray for your's "spoiler words" man. "Ice car freak" and "Potenkim 2"...no, please don't do this ARCSC....

[SkyKing]

Wow, WTF about Noel huh? So she's gonna play pretty much like CS1 minus the Haida Loop, with still no real BnBs midscreen without 5D guessing and counter hits. Although I am glad to see Tsubaki somewhat viable now. And Tager for high? Pretty cool.