LunarSelenia Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 I know what you meant. That's why I'm not making any real judgments on anything just because there hasnt been any deeper discovery as of yet. People (like Dusk) want to haul ass because we cant rely on super easy 5D taps for charge among other things. Yeah the nerfs are bad but NOT horrible. Oh. I understand ya =3 I kind of like a bit of her changes actually, makes a bit of sense (except the 5B thing >>;; ) And ERROL: I didn't catch the last part of your post before I quoted it XDDD In reply: I'LL MAKE IT WORK. =3 I'll find a way. Even if I get my ass handed to me I will learn and improve how to deal with the PMS Murakumo...
SolarMisae Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Lunar is still firmly in the bargaining stage. The Lunar vs Solar youtube matches are going to be a lot less interesting in extend :< And why is that? Leave my robutt alone!
HajinShinobi Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 The nerf to 5B is the one thing that urks me the most above all her other changes. I dont mind doing abit more to gain charges, and having to be more aerial (which it seems like were going to have to do now, maybe). And I'm not bothered by the damage nerf, everyone practically received that anyway.
SolarMisae Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 ...Tsubaki needs to be in the air more...? ... Yeah I see where Errol was coming from now.
HajinShinobi Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 ...Tsubaki needs to be in the air more...? ... Yeah I see where Errol was coming from now. It's been looking that way, yes. But it's not certain.
Airk Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 And I'm not bothered by the damage nerf, everyone practically received that anyway. I'd be happier if this were more true. The so called 'global damage nerf' seems to have been inconsistently applied at best. Makoto does way less damage now, but Noel does practically the same, if the recent videos are anything to go by. Word on the street is that Mu and Valk aren't exactly hurting for damage either. Doesn't sound as universal as one might like.
LunarSelenia Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 5B being slower...I don't know what they intend with that really. I mean granted it is a good range poke for a rushdown character, I guess they're trying to nerf it so that we need to really be up close and personal like Makoto? (this is just my guess) Gah, the more I talk about it, the more I really want to have Extend to figure out some of the changes they mentioned. 22X starter with greater prorate, how slow 5B/5D really is, how much damage Tsubaki can get average now....blah. The waiting continues. EDIT: Like I said, I'll find a way, I'll make it work ;__; ... ..somehow...
Errol Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) 'universal nerf' always means 'except for the new top tier, duh' @Lunar We have seen some interesting, unconventional strategies in the video thread to deal. One amusing video had copious use of resets. This could work but I think another strategy might work even better for you: Just leave it within reach, maybe on top of the tv, etc.. Edited November 22, 2011 by Errol
HajinShinobi Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) I'd be happier if this were more true. The so called 'global damage nerf' seems to have been inconsistently applied at best. Makoto does way less damage now, but Noel does practically the same, if the recent videos are anything to go by. Word on the street is that Mu and Valk aren't exactly hurting for damage either. Doesn't sound as universal as one might like. Yeah I've been noticing that too, as I'm always watching more than just Tsubaki's match videos. Obviously everyone didnt receive the same amount of a nerf for their damage, while one or a few received abit of a buff (Ragna). Edited November 22, 2011 by HajinShinobi
LunarSelenia Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 @Errol: Ahahahahaha will do, or maybe one day all the Nutella will disappear and she'll go nuts from Nutella withdrawals....can't do Mu laser setups on an empty stomach. @Hajin: Oh well, it's what Arcsys decided and all we can do is wonder why the hell they did it and deal X__X;;;; unfortunately. Valk still does stupid damage, but nothing compared to CS1 stupid damage.
Rhiya Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 I know what you meant. That's why I'm not making any real judgments on anything just because there hasnt been any deeper discovery as of yet. People (like Dusk) want to haul ass because we cant rely on super easy 5D taps for charge among other things. Yeah the nerfs are bad but NOT horrible. I can't rely on easy things, so I'm bailing? Yeah, I'm sure. Tsubaki has never been a win-button character. Her good combos were hard, her mixup was okay at best, her spacing game was nothing but 5b/shield rush. The closest thing she had to a truly abusable move was 236D, but it cost charge. I care about winning over character loyalty in BB. I'd rather play Tsubaki, yes, but that's because I'm familiar with the character.
BeaverDeity Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 I can't wait for Tsubaki to go lower in the tiers :3 loooooove using weaker characters.
SolarMisae Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 'universal nerf' always means 'except for the new top tier, duh' >>... Lunar: Ahaha, that strategy...might...actually work. ._.;
HajinShinobi Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) I can't rely on easy things, so I'm bailing? Yeah, I'm sure. Tsubaki has never been a win-button character. Her good combos were hard, her mixup was okay at best, her spacing game was nothing but 5b/shield rush. The closest thing she had to a truly abusable move was 236D, but it cost charge. I care about winning over character loyalty in BB. I'd rather play Tsubaki, yes, but that's because I'm familiar with the character. I have no problem with you wanting to change characters, or about this loyalty you speak of. I only mentioned your name in the first place because you're so quick to believe this character is already a low or bottom tier character in the new iteration. She could be, or she could be abit lower in mid-tier. We dont know that yet since nothing has been set in stone. Especially in such a short amount of time. Edited November 22, 2011 by HajinShinobi
iPoke Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 >>... Lunar: Ahaha, that strategy...might...actually work. ._.; You people don't know the powers you are contending with! Nutella will literally rape your mouth with flavor. It will face fuck your taste buds! It- it happened to me... I'll never be the same again.. ... Though you could always buy the little nutella packs and throw them across the room to distract her.
HajinShinobi Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 @iPoke: ^ Please keep those types of posts in the other General Discussion.. -_-
Kiba Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Look at Kiba back in CS1 he didn't give a shit about tiers and still blew people up Tiers don't phase me fortunately. Most of the time I don't even follow them because I'd like to have explanations which are not provided. I just use Tsubaki because when I saw BBCS she was the only character that interested me because of her difference in playstyle, I like her attacks and her character design. If she becomes broken tier; don't care. If she becomes shit; don't care. As long as I'm having fun with her that's what counts. I'm still quite salty about 'blowing people up' but that's a different story which I've revisited too many times :v I can respect Dusk's thought on not wanting to use Tsubaki, but does that mean you don't like working hard? Btw, I'm going to state in advance that you shouldn't take this the wrong way. I'm merely curious. Valk still does stupid damage Really? I thought the damage was fine.
Rhiya Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 I can respect Dusk's thought on not wanting to use Tsubaki, but does that mean you don't like working hard? Btw, I'm going to state in advance that you shouldn't take this the wrong way. I'm merely curious. Except for the most broken and braindead charas, you're going to have to work hard with anyone. The difference is in how much return you get for that hard work -- if the results are proportional to your effort. So no, I don't mind working hard, but I should get the return for that hard work I deserve.
LunarSelenia Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Really? I thought the damage was fine. I probably am saying this in comparison to Tsubaki, just seeing how overall her damage is decreased by certain combos and Valk still sees 4k. Take it as a bit of salt flying from my end X__X;;;
Kiba Posted November 22, 2011 Posted November 22, 2011 Except for the most broken and braindead charas, you're going to have to work hard with anyone. The difference is in how much return you get for that hard work -- if the results are proportional to your effort. So no, I don't mind working hard, but I should get the return for that hard work I deserve. I can see your point. Fair play there. I probably am saying this in comparison to Tsubaki, just seeing how overall her damage is decreased by certain combos and Valk still sees 4k. Take it as a bit of salt flying from my end X__X;;; Oh in that sense I can relate, haha.
BatousaiJ Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 Mooo Mooooooooo Mooooo Mooo MOOOO!!! Mooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!! I'LL MAKE IT WORK. =3 I'll find a way. Even if I get my ass handed to me I will learn and improve how to deal with the PMS Murakumo... @Solar - What? @Lunar - There's the attitude I like to see.
pktazn Posted November 23, 2011 Author Posted November 23, 2011 Just wanted to note that the ones who's damage has hardly changed are the ones who have hardly changed from CS2 in the first place. The damage nerf IMO is pretty universal if only 4-5 characters out of 19 are doing 3k-4k consistently. Most of the high damage is in the corner as well for most of them.
Errol Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 (edited) TBH, it doesn't matter what you call it, all that matters is the current state, which quite frankly is the same as CS2, CS1, CT, etc. Characters aren't created equal, and sometimes they start out equal and then god decides to nerf their 5b. Some characters end up at the top of the heap and others at the bottom, damage is a part of that. No change affects characters equally anyway, even something 'universal' like barrier block changes. Edited November 23, 2011 by Errol
Airk Posted November 23, 2011 Posted November 23, 2011 Just wanted to note that the ones who's damage has hardly changed are the ones who have hardly changed from CS2 in the first place. The damage nerf IMO is pretty universal if only 4-5 characters out of 19 are doing 3k-4k consistently. Most of the high damage is in the corner as well for most of them. Dunno. You could work this out scientifically, but I don't think anyone here really knows, say, how much damage Arakune does right now (Probably answer: Tons with curse) or whatever. But it's not global. Especially with characters like Bang and Ragna actually going UP. And as soon as we stop pretending that 'oh, everyone got a damage nerf, so it's not that bad' the closer we'll be to reconciling to the current state of our character. But fundamentally, stuff like this makes me discouraged for the game as a whole, because it shows that, really, Arc Sys doesn't really know WTF they're doing. Their modus operandi seems to be "nerf the everyloving crap out of the top character or two, and just kinda hand out random stuff to the rest of the cast without even doing basic theoryfighting on what that will do the character." I don't know what sort of data gathering they do, and obviously it's just a few short loktests, but you'd think that, relying even on just that, they'd try to make changes that make some sense, but obviously, their sense of what "makes sense" is pretty radically divorced from what most other people think. What's more, they still seem to be struggling with the fact that they're in the digital age here, and don't need to sell people new arcade boards everytime they want to tune something. These screwy "big updates" based on like, 5 days of playtests by random people really need to go and be replaced by a more methodical approach to patching and versions.
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