Level5-Chan Posted December 3, 2013 Posted December 3, 2013 It's kinda ironic that we say that she is better that Extend (and believe me, I agreed), but that we had some difficulty accepting her changes. She's still a good character, but, yes, she got overshadowed by the more better characters that people don't see her much. I have to admit: If it's not for the Overdrive, the Beam Shield Rush ([4]6D > 236D) and the Damage overall buff, I would preferred the Extend version (even though she is bad.)
Errol Posted December 3, 2013 Posted December 3, 2013 konan prefers the EX version. though none of the other japanese players do as far as I can tell.
Airk Posted December 3, 2013 Posted December 3, 2013 konan prefers the EX version. though none of the other japanese players do as far as I can tell. Well, Konan does tend to be more of a... I don't want to say "sloppy" but maybe "relaxed" player; By which I mean he does a lot of strange stuff and drops combos, and wins anyway. Maybe the added irritating complexities of the character mean it's unpleasant/too hard for him to play the way he likes.
Tsubaki 5B Posted December 4, 2013 Posted December 4, 2013 actually i'm curious now i feel that she is a little bit better in this game and i feel she does do fairly well against a decent amount of the cast i see it as slow progress for her overall into being a very dominant character and the tsubaki thread is still top tier lol
Airk Posted December 4, 2013 Posted December 4, 2013 actually i'm curious now i feel that she is a little bit better in this game and i feel she does do fairly well against a decent amount of the cast i see it as slow progress for her overall into being a very dominant character and the tsubaki thread is still top tier lol She did fairly well against a decent amount of the cast in Extend too. Just sayin'.
AJSmith325 Posted December 5, 2013 Posted December 5, 2013 Extend Tsubaki and Extend overall made me quit that game. I like CS2 tsubaki the best but I do think CP tsubaki is a good character. Fireballs and command grab actually help out a lot in certain match-ups
BatousaiJ Posted December 6, 2013 Posted December 6, 2013 Blahbidi Blahbidi Blahbidi Blah. Anyway, since I finished up my video, I'm going to go ahead and post up some stuff that didn't make it in there due to whatever reason. Some stuff you guys might already know, some you might not. Lets see, first off, there's a trick to making 236D fake crossover in the corner. Lock them in with a blade super block string, any thing will work and then once they're in blockstun of the blade super, you can 236D and it will do the animation of you crossing to the other side but you'll still be on the same side. The reason this happens is because they're constantly getting pushed back due to blocking the blade super that there won't e room on the other side even if it tries to go there so you can just 5A and trick them into blocking the wrong side. 3CC can be RC'ed for a full 22D charged for very good damage anywhere on the screen(they'll bounce off the wall allowing for 6CC continuation and etc), just as good of damage as you're going to get off the FC version, in fact. The timing is somewhat tight but it's practical and very doable after practice. During the part of the video where I show the various 2BB shenanigans, there was one I was going to put in where they don't tech and you pick them back up in blue beat with 2BB > 2CC. You can end that combo with a hj.C > j.CC > j.214D with proper timing to land in front of them so you can actually make them slide towards you allowing for 6C to combo at that point setting up for even more gimmicks like 6C > blade super and etc. Back throw into Mugen for 6CC continuation is a good bang for your charge/meter as well and so is 6A > 5CC > 6B > Mugen with 2 or more charges and will give you about 4.5k damage and straight ground B series ender with 6A > 5CC > 6B > Mugen > 46D > 236D > 214D > 623D > j.236D > j.214D > 6CC > 236C > 214C > 22B. I like the overhead into mugen because they damage is pretty good for an overhead starter and plus, it makes them get overly worried about that 6A which makes them start mashing buttons after 5B/B which can setup for easy counter hits and etc. You can RC any ground hits of j.C/C > j.214B/C for easy 3.2 k ish damage with a 6CC continuation. The only time you can reliably get corner 6CC off a j.214D hit is on a air to air hit, and it won't work if they were on the ground. That's why the best times to use j.214D as a combo extender is when you get people trying to jump out in the corner and grab them with a 5B or 5C/C and then covert immediately into j.CC > j.214D > 6CC and etc. That's about what I can think of from the top of my head for now but I may add more in the future. If you check out the video and want to ask about something, feel free as I deliberately cut some of those combos short for the sake of brevity and editing.
Kiba Posted December 6, 2013 Posted December 6, 2013 You created a nice video Bat. I particularly liked the 3C FC combo you used in the corner that racked up 4.4k because it's better than the one I had listed: FC 3CC > 623C > j.214D > 6C > CT > 5C > 2CC > 236C > (5A) > 5C > 2C > 236B > 214B > 22B [4646 (4719) DM] Not only are you using charge to get an extra 200 damage which I think is a waste, but it's slightly harder. Getting 4.7k is inconsistent because doing getting 236C > 5C to work is height specific and requires very specific timing of the delayed 2CC. We're better off opting for your combo. 623C > Delay j.214A > 5C is even easier on FC. The video is also a nice reference for those who are looking for more tricks to add to their game. I'll get it down in the strategy guide.
BatousaiJ Posted December 6, 2013 Posted December 6, 2013 Sure, always happy to help with the guides =d.
BatousaiJ Posted December 15, 2013 Posted December 15, 2013 A quick note on burst baiting. Bursts are a bit quicker now and have foot attribute so we can no longer dodge bursts with a sly 214D. We can use a 623C/D to dodge the burst but if you're not baiting it in the air and/or you don't have charge to follow up with, you can't do much and you'll be recovering from DP frames by the time they get out of burst recovery so it's a bad idea unless you've got the prerequisite charge amount and are just basically feeling yourself as the opponent is about to burst in the air. So normal burst baiting with Tsu is dependent on what moves are jump cancel-able. 5A/5B/2C/6C all provide a burst bait opportunity simply by inputting 5A/2C/5B/6C > hold up back. Of the bunch, I find 5B to be the most effective because it's our go-to mid range poke and look natural as it's a common starter for a myriad of options. Bait a DP and have a feeling they're going to burst? 5B > up back and you'll land in time for a dash 5CC for whatever you please. You won't have time for a 6C starter or 5C CH > 6C since they're not in counter state during burst recovery so I would say a dash 5CC would be our best starter in that situation.
Kiba Posted December 15, 2013 Posted December 15, 2013 Times like this I wish 5C was jump cancellable again, since there are times I know my opponent will burst and I can't do anything about it. Examples of burst baits: -air throw > 6C > jump and hold up back -corner (5BB > 5CC > ) 22D > 6C > jump and hold up back I've even managed to unintentionally avoid a burst whilst using 236X in a combo, & OD. Anyway thanks, I'll get that in the guide.
BatousaiJ Posted December 15, 2013 Posted December 15, 2013 (edited) Agreed, most people familiar with the match up will know that 5C CH will spell a ton of incoming damage and will often burst right after the 5C and we could burst bait using it but that's no longer an option. A cute way to condition your opponent to burst after 5B would be to show that you can 5B CH > 6CC previously but then you'd obviously lose out on damage compared to the 5C CH starter but it would make them more likely to burst off a 5B. I do it sometimes when they don't have a burst and it's going to be the kill combo anyway just to show that I can but that's layers of mind games going on at that point intending to pay off later down then line during a very long set. I'm going to guess that they didn't intent for Tsu to have her 5C > j.BB combos so they took it out but it's an annoying loss all the same. On a unrelated note, I've begun to try and condition myself to 5A > 5B gatling instead of 5A > 5BB as I find I drop a lot of air continuations when stragglers get hit trying to up-back or something similar and as the second hit of the 5BB either hits or whiffs, it makes picking them up with j.B significantly more difficult and the timing window becomes very precise. I would simply opt to input the second hit of 5BB after confirming the hit on the ground or perhaps go straight into 5C afterwards to lessen the proration a bit but that doesn't really matter too much if the starting hit is 5A. Edited December 15, 2013 by BatousaiJ
Errol Posted December 15, 2013 Posted December 15, 2013 Yeah. Wouldn't matter too much if they didn't decide to make 5b particularly bad as a starter. you're right on the air hits. Confirming to airhits is still on the rough side for tsubaki. 5bb> j.B is now tight because of the 5bb attack level nerf. but really the problem is more that 5bb whiffs so much. if 5bb would actually hit you still have more time to confirm into an air hit than if you just 5a5b. But that's the thing, you've gotta confirm that they jumped when 5b hits. and if you're mashing b, then 5bb will automatically come out and whiff. I think you have the right idea. when 5c hits an airborne opponent I usually have no problem because 5cc will usually hit. Note that I rarely do 5a5c, that's why. if I get an airborne hit with 5c it's because I did raw 5c, and then 5cc hits. which easily confirms into jC for a pretty good combo with 1 charge. Overall I'd say on wakeup you should try to avoid using jabs now if at all possible. there's still lots of other cases to use jabs a lot though, and if you want to be able to confirm you really need to just do 5a>5b and see what is going on before you press another button.
BatousaiJ Posted December 16, 2013 Posted December 16, 2013 Very true. There's little reason to jab on wake up unless you're setting up for a throw or command grab. Otherwise, a meaty 5B is better for just about every option imaginable. 5A/2A are still very good pokes and definitely the right button to press during those close quarters situation where each frame matters especially 5A since it will hit crouching unlike many other 5As.
BatousaiJ Posted December 16, 2013 Posted December 16, 2013 Two scenario I recorded for "Scarlet Tempest" that didn't make it in there due to editing and time constraints. It shows some of the stuff you can do to punish if they try to avoid the 2BB mix-up by not teching. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eqmw8s05xj4&feature=youtu.be
Velvien Posted December 27, 2013 Posted December 27, 2013 (edited) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oj9rYubGPec Kara command grab. Input is (supposedly, as I haven't gotten it to work) 63216C4C. Edited December 27, 2013 by Velvien
Zouf Posted December 29, 2013 Posted December 29, 2013 I just discovered that you can kara throw with 6C. I was wondering how people could throw after 6B, it never worked for me. Now I know, damn.
Kiba Posted December 29, 2013 Posted December 29, 2013 Pretty surprised at myself that I didn't include that in the strategy guide. Well it's there now along with the kara command grab.
Velvien Posted December 30, 2013 Posted December 30, 2013 Regarding the j.236A oki: Against Platinum and Litchi use 5B > 2CC instead of 5C because the 5C whiffs.Against Carl you use need to use the 623C > Delay j.214A route. 5C and 5B whiffs on Carl normally.The setup does not work against Taokaka, Bang, Tager and Hakumen. I've found that off of a couple of combos (5BB > 5CC > 236C > 214B > 22B > (5D >) 5C > 2CC > 7j.236A, and Throw > 236C > 214B > 22B > 5C > 2CC > 7j.236A), taking a single step forward after the 22B will allow the 5C > 2CC to connect on Litchi, Carl and, with a slight delay on the 7j.236A, Hakumen and Bang, and also seems needed to work on Makoto. This of course does require omitting the 5D often used in these combos, though. As for Platinum and Taokaka, doing 2B after the 22B will allow the oki to work. However, the throw combo doesn't work on them; blue beats before the 2C. And again, probably requires omitting 5D from the combo. Nothing seems to work on Tager, though.
Zouf Posted December 31, 2013 Posted December 31, 2013 Pretty surprised at myself that I didn't include that in the strategy guide. Well it's there now along with the kara command grab. Your explanation of the kara throw command is a little off. You actually don't need to input 6C~C+B, 6C~B works wonder. You can even delay quite a lot the "B" and it will extend the range even further. If you're playing with an arcade stick it feels pretty smooth and natural. Now i only use this to throw lol
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