ACR A.B.A. Changes and Discussion of

[Cotoneaster]

Hey all, I didn't see a thread for this yet but have seen several others for other characters so I thought I'd start one.

From what I've seen in the main thread (as of the June 2nd loketest):

From Teyah's post http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?13487-Guilty-Gear-Accent-Core-Plus-R!-Loketests-June-2-3!&p=1336698&viewfull=1#post1336698:

- Goku Moroha mode: damage up, damage penalty from hits landed reduced, longer duration, more powerful overall.

- 236D FB fireball in Moroha or Goku Moroha: more hits, travel distance increased.

- 5H now gatlings to 2H.

- 5H now vacuums in on second hit, has slower startup, cannot be comboed from far 5S.

- Moroha mode gauge moved to be above tension gauge.

- Now has 4 bloodpacks, up from 3.

- Can't do double Keygrab anymore.

So, thoughts? Having an extra bloodpack sounds pretty useful but I'm a little apprehensive over losing double keygrab.

Edited June 3, 2012 by Cotoneaster
Updated info

[Sashi]

Reading the Japanese wiki on A.B.A updates.

4 Bloodpacks

Goku Moroha

-Something something, duration is longer.

Keygrab

-Longer recovery, double keystab is gone.

Moroha:

-5HS

--Vacuum -> 2S Gatling (What? Really? Typo, maybe?)

Orbs:

-Less recovery (?)

I think my Japanese is just really really bad.

Edited June 3, 2012 by Sashi

[FormerlyUnknown]

i'm sad at double key loss, that was the most swag thing about the character.

[Cotoneaster]

Maybe arc was thinking double keygrab was too strong? I'm also wondering if there will be any changes to normal A.B.A.. Maybe some combos replacing a second keygrab with a bloodpack will become viable, or maybe a moroha setup into goku moroha for the kill. I don't suppose any footage from the loketest has surfaced?

[furix]

I don't care much about double keystab being lost, since we got an extra blood pack in return. In the end, healing with blood pack is just way better than double keystab. Though one might lose momentum, the extra blood pack is really appriciated.

Also her overall boosts hopefully help her out more.

Now make her start in Moroha mode and that'd be awesome lololol jk

[Sashi]

Keep her in constant Goku Moroha. Mash Buttons: The Game.

On a more serious note, really excited about the new Goku Moroha mode. Hopefully it allows some really flashy stuff.

[TD]

activating goku moroha still consumes a bloodpack right?

[vZakat]

http://youtu.be/MGxGFek2glw

Here's a little bit of footage of aba from the loketest.

[Ukujiku]

Surprised this didn't make the highlight video of loketest 2. Not an A.B.A. player so I don't know if this is a new combo or not. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtQX0eBufYw

[DistortedGuilt]

Im fairly new to A.B.A and look forward to using her on AC+R, i have played AC+ and i did use her the most but i never comboed or did anything strategic.

Hopefully ill enjoy the changes made on this new re-balance :P

[doragonkoroshi]

You guys should get things going in here. Lots of new ABA here http://www.twitch.tv/joniosan/b/332937159

Some things I noticed as a non-ABA player

-5h hits twice and pulls in on the second hit. not sure if it has the over-her-head hitbox that it used to, or if that hitbox was replaced with this new second hit in the region of the first hit.

-i've seen her get knocked down 3 times in a row, and still have enough moroha left to get out of trouble, so no free hits at least if you're knocked down 3 consecutive times without having used much meter beforehand. maybe it's even something like she comes back with a minimum amount of moroha or something. i don't think i've seen a wakeup "suka" animation yet.

-double key grab is still possible if the first one is used against a grounded opponent. I think this happened somewhere in the day 1 mikado tournament. is key grab no longer an actual grab? i don't think i've seen it used as a regular grab yet. Also, saw a normal throw, slide, key grab attempt whiff on dizzy. not sure what this means, but i saw it attempted and whiffed.

-lots of goku moroha activation. i guess it's really good now or something.

[tyrio]

Thanks for the video! It has some really neat stuff. Some things I noticed:

Throw, dash, keygrab has always been weight specific I think. It worked on Johnny.

Danzai FRC

Ground Unblockable FRC

Butt is jump cancelable (!!) in Goku Moroha.

You can link f.S into itself a couple of times in Goku Moroha

Goku Moroha seems really good now.

3rd hit of Rekka causes enough groundslide to combo without FRC in the corner.

Dizzy has a longer range ice stalagmite now?

[Darkside937]

You guys should get things going in here. Lots of new ABA here http://www.twitch.tv/joniosan/b/332937159

Some things I noticed as a non-ABA player

-5h hits twice and pulls in on the second hit. not sure if it has the over-her-head hitbox that it used to, or if that hitbox was replaced with this new second hit in the region of the first hit.

-i've seen her get knocked down 3 times in a row, and still have enough moroha left to get out of trouble, so no free hits at least if you're knocked down 3 consecutive times without having used much meter beforehand. maybe it's even something like she comes back with a minimum amount of moroha or something. i don't think i've seen a wakeup "suka" animation yet.

-double key grab is still possible if the first one is used against a grounded opponent. I think this happened somewhere in the day 1 mikado tournament. is key grab no longer an actual grab? i don't think i've seen it used as a regular grab yet. Also, saw a normal throw, slide, key grab attempt whiff on dizzy. not sure what this means, but i saw it attempted and whiffed.

-lots of goku moroha activation. i guess it's really good now or something.

[Mooshi-Q]

That would be absolutely ridiculous if she had an FRC on her regular Moroha Danzai. I'm calling shenanigans.

Anyway, this shit HERE at about 9:30 interests me.

She automatically goes into a dragon install while in normal mode once her health hits around 10% it looks like. Speed boost? Damage? Defense? All of the above? What's the deal?!

EDIT: Ahhhhh. I got so excited at the prospect of auto power-ups that I didn't notice that she gets clipped by Faust's poison off-screen. Booooooooooooooooooooo.

Edited September 30, 2012 by Mooshi-Q

[quartercirclebk]

Can we chat, friends?

Copy/pasted from the Guilty Room thread, with some translation added (had to look up some of these):

a.b.a

moroha gauge above the tension bar

normal mode

c.S

wider hitbox on front

f.S

larger moving distance

2K

wider hitbox on front

j.H

larger hitbox at the back

j.D

untech time on counterhit from 44 to 50f

6H

higher float

untech time from 30 to 35f

throw

distance opponent is thrown away shortened

ketsugou (strike)

recovery after hit increased by 8f

ketsugou (throw)

knockdown time after throw increased by 8f

dangoku

slide time increased from 32 to 43f

FB kenin (Slide)

frc-able in the middle of movement

shouko intoku (far)

frc-able when aba stops dashing in

shouko intoku

3rd hit unblockable removed

2nd and 3rd hit command input and startup faster

knocks down on counterhit

moroha mode

5H

added 2nd hit

2nd hit vacuums

startup longer by 4f

guardbar reduce rate decreased from 11 to 6

j.H

proration at 80%

6H

untech time increased from 18 to 23f

ketsugou (strike)

recovery after hit increased by 8f

ketsugou (throw)

knockdown time after throw increased by 8f

bunri (Bloodpack back to normal mode)

recovery shorter by 6f

frc-able around 18-21f

fukumetsu (2nd Rekka)

untech time increased from 18 to 35f

higher float on air hit

larger hitbox

kashitsu (Unblockable)

damage increased from 50 to 60

FB kihi

hits increased from 2 to 6

faster ball speed

FB danzai

80% proration on the 2nd hit

shouko inmetsu (ouro) (Air Super)

untechable time increased from 24 to 44f

henshitsu (Goku Moroha activation)

opponent flung farther away on air hit

wallbounces on air hit

restores moroha gauge by 100%

reaction damage lessened from 100 to 85%

moroha gauge decreases slower by itself

hitting opponent during goku moroha will make reduce moroha gauge shorter

goku moroha mode

c.S

recovery shorter by 1f

5H

startup slower by 4f

reduces guardbar by 6

j.P

recovery shorter by 10f

j.S

recovery shorter by 4f

j.D

startup faster by 2f

recovery shorter by 3f

fukumetsu

hitbox larger

________________________

So, thoughts? There's a ton of little buffs that kind of mitigate the loss (maybe?) of double keygrab. It looks like normal throw to keygrab will be less character specific, and the reduction of self-damage in Moroha and the slower decrease will help out. I like the bloodpack FRC a lot - I really wanted to see a Suka animation FRC though, a tradeoff of tension for safety, but oh well. The general hitbox buffs in normal mode make me happy too, smart footsies just got a little more effective. Not needing FRC for rekkas in the corner is extra nice - more tension for those ultra-painful butt RC to double orb combos. Goku Moroha changes will at the very least breathe a little extra fun into the character. FB Bloodball distance increased, huh. Old setups will go out the window, but new ones will take their place and probably be better thanks to the 6 hits. Blockstun ahoy. Non FRC'd rekkas, bloodball, IAD j.H/2K/tick throw mixup, perhaps?

I'm mixed on 5H. Really don't like the startup increase. j.H proration makes me go "Oh god why", I abuse that move way too much.

Let's get cracking, folks - other character forums seem to be way ahead in terms of updates and discussion!

Edited October 5, 2012 by quartercirclebk
whoops

[zdravkelja]

Goku Moroha is scary. Venom match.

[Darkside937]

Holy shit, Tsubu is a fucking steamroller.

Things I noticed:

- Rekka loops look godlike. Good damage and fullscreen corner carry, no meter required. The 2nd Rekka having more untech time will help against random air hits as well (if they try to jump out and eat a 2nd Rekka, they still get combo'd instead of teching away).

- Goku Moroha is going to be ridiculous. In addition to the obvious buffs the move has received (completely refills Moroha gauge, less self-inflicted damage, lasts longer, etc), it has an indirect buff that shouldn't be overlooked: its unique ability to be super-cancelled into from nearly every move A.B.A. has. This means that any time she has 50% meter or more and a bloodpack, she has access to a safe frametrap that staggers on counterhit, wallbounces in the corner, and is plus on block, meaning literally ANY time she does something punishable, the threat of eating a huge Goku Moroha combo or at the very least being forced to deal with her insane pressure in that mode will be looming. Technically, she can already do this in AC, but with Goku Moroha being much more threatening now, it will be worth it--I'm predicting this will end up being REALLY stupid.

- Normal mode throw distance decreased = much easier to get keygrab from throw. I can confirm that on Axl and Dizzy, she doesn't even need to dash anymore--just throw and keygrab. It looks like this will likely be the case on other characters as well.

- Bloodpack FRC is fast as fuck. Practically guaranteed safe way out of Moroha if you have a pack and 25%.

Questions I have:

- Did they change Kashitsu aside from the damage buff? It looks like A.B.A.s are using it more, and it seems like it's landing more too. If they made it so you can't normal airblock it, I might just cry.

Edited October 8, 2012 by Darkside937

[quartercirclebk]

Rets go, get it on

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ou1zsW-t9a4

Can't really watch this in its entirety at work, but Honnou posted it on Twitter saying it's one of the best sets he's seen in a while. This is like, my least favorite matchup, so I can't wait to see how it goes down. One of the comments is a guy hoping the rekka loops only work on Potemkin... haw haw haw.

[Sex Cowboy]

Blood pack FRC=>key grab gave me a slight boner, I won't lie.

And yeah, the set is excellent. Long sets between top players are always educational.

[Scottie Yosh]

Ahh aba looks so sick, want to play!

[furix]

Blood pack FRC=>key grab gave me a slight boner, I won't lie.

And yeah, the set is excellent. Long sets between top players are always educational.

http://youtu.be/ou1zsW-t9a4?t=9m52s If you are talking about that part.. Yewp, same here... I had to re-watch that so many times, I could so get off to that no lie.

[quartercirclebk]

http://youtu.be/ou1zsW-t9a4?t=9m52s If you are talking about that part.. Yewp, same here... I had to re-watch that so many times, I could so get off to that no lie.

Oh lawdy. Bloodpack FRC -> Keygrab is the new double keygrab, kinda. 25% tension is a fair trade off for all the health back.

[geist]

Oh lawdy. Bloodpack FRC -> Keygrab is the new double keygrab, kinda. 25% tension is a fair trade off for all the health back.

75%, that was in goku moroha >.>

danzai->bloodpack wouldn't cancel in normal

there's a possibility of finding something in regular, but it obviously won't give THAT much health back

edit: of course, just noticed that the combo done gave more than 50% tension

I'm starting to realize just how absolutely dumb goku moroha is

Edited October 23, 2012 by geist

[Sex Cowboy]

Tsubu does do 5HS, blood pack FRC => key grab during regular Moroha mode. What I can't really wrap my head around is Tsubu's thought process behind using Goku Moroha vs. 5HS, Blood blah blah blah after a rekka loop. The only thing I can think of is him going for Goku Moroha to kill, but I'm not really too sure.

The most boner-rific part of that set is 33:00, when Tsubu goes nuts in Goku Moroha. It gave me a boner almost as hard as the one I got when Tsubu dizzied FAB at SBO.

[AeternumSomnium]

The most boner-rific part of that set is 33:00, when Tsubu goes nuts in Goku Moroha. It gave me a boner almost as hard as the one I got when Tsubu dizzied FAB at SBO.

I am also kind of on the fence of the pros vs. cons of Goku--although I'll be first to admit I'm not the best A.B.A.

That being said, watching that 33:00 part (As well as some of those other barrages), was, well, God it was just glorious, my faith has been--in part--renewed. She's too interesting of a character to ignore. . .