[CP] Iron Tager Gameplay Discussion

[Dark Ranger88]

Timestamp didn't work for me, but it says 9m51s in the link.

[NumeroGaijin]

You know what guys.....I think I may switch off Tager. I have maining him since CT. Even before when I said to myself that I wouldn't main him I did anyway. Seriously Arcsys, why is that you continue to develop direct counters to Tager EVERY game. There is mostly no way he will ever beat Kokonoe at all given her abilities and how I have seen them work. We will have to depend on spark all over again. We need 2 bars for spark.

[mAc Chaos]

Kokonoe beating Tager makes a certain amount of hilarious sense.

[Brice]

I don't really see how Tager cannot beat Kokonoe at all... care to explain your thoughts?

Sure, Graviton looks like a real pain to deal with if they decide to activate it, but isn't it a repulsion from the center of the graviton? If you're in between Kokonoe and the graviton they won't activate it.

But I can see that by just having a Graviton up, can Tager move even from the strong attraction of the Graviton... although it seems to deplete the gauge really fast to either put a Graviton up or activating it.

It feels to me like the early match up you can theorize is that it's going to still be a time out strategy.

If you wanna go one step further, I'm feeling that we won't be able to move but if we have Spark Bolt, they won't be able to set up stuff by fear of losing everything on the screen and being in a situation of knockdown against Tager.

[NumeroGaijin]

My one problem is that it looks as though it will be another matchup that requires our dependency on Spark. That to me is stupid for obvious reasons. Spark really isn't that dependable in the first place. We just use it is a gimmicky scare tactic in matches where we have to depend on it. Vs. Kokonoe is gonna be stupid because not only the Gravitron but also her other Rachel-like keepaway tools. I just get the feeling that her tools once they are utilized fully we will have a matchup that consists of timeout and maybe chip out strategy will the beam super. This matchup to me seems like it will be a mix of Rachel and Litchi in one....only without the pole.

[TagerTime]

I am only upset about one thing. They finally gave Tager his beam super that i said he should have had along time ago, except he only uses it for his master Kokonoe.....

Im so mad!!!! Tager needs this super on his own too!!!!! Not only just to help Kokonoe!!!

[Valthazeryus]

I much rather they make his Overdrive a bit more resourceful than just quickening the Spark Gauge. :/

[NumeroGaijin]

I agree with you Val but this is Arcsys we are talking about here. By the way who is the highest ranked Tager and what is his number thingy?

[Valthazeryus]

Pink no Akuma (ピンクの悪魔) and Grandia (ラスク_グランディア_) at 17 Dan(段).

[A.X.I.S.]

Ah they both went up to 17th Dan :D

I miss the age of Akira.

[Brice]

My one problem is that it looks as though it will be another match up that requires our dependency on Spark. That to me is stupid for obvious reasons.

I don't see a problem in depending on an extremely good, but scarce resource. Spark Bolt is still the best non super projectile in the game, and now that you can shoot it upward, it's even better.

Spark really isn't that dependable in the first place.

I cannot agree with your point here. Spark Bolt is an option that you have. Whether you wanna depend on it or not is solely based on either your opinion, or the match up experience you can process from hours of videos and I see that this option is very dependable to make people stop doing whatever stuff that's punishable by Spark Bolt.

We just use it is a gimmicky scare tactic in matches where we have to depend on it.

I have to say again that the "holding on" to your Spark Bolt to scare the opponent isn't a gimmicky tactic. The tactic behind this is that when you get Spark Bolt, you should only use it for 3 purposes : hitconfirming (for example, hitconfirming a random 5C that hit on the tip), extending a combo (either to get extra magnetism or going for the kill) or punishing something.

of course, there's some exceptions like getting some magnetism when the time out is in 10 seconds, but I'm naming the main usage I perceive how Spark Bolt should be used to make me win.

the consequence to using it for this purpose is that you might be holding onto it for a long time in the match, even more so against players that know the match up.

Vs. Kokonoe is gonna be stupid because not only the Gravitron but also her other Rachel-like keepaway tools.

I believe that Kokonoe won't have nonpunishable keep away tools. I might be wrong. I'll try to state my stance on this one.

What makes Rachel so good at keep away even when Tager has Spark is that she got 2-3 different tools that can make you waste your Spark Bolt if they guess correctly.

I'm thinking about George XIII, Pumpkin activation and overall wind drive.

If you try to punish a random summon and Rachel decides to TK George, he will take the hit for her with no real penalty to Rachel.

If a pumpkin is already out, she can activate the pumpkin while blocking, or activate it to punish you for attempting Spark Bolt.

She can just be in the air and stay there throwing stuff at you and you can't really do anything about it if she's not magnetised.

Although the last part will change with the new upward Spark in BBCP, it could still be a problem if you have to guess to either shoot up or down.

As far as we have seen Kokonoe in action, I'm guessing there's enough recovery on pretty much everything she wanna do to keep away that we can just Spark on reaction.

Again, I haven't tested anything obviously, but I don't really see her as bad as say Relius, Rachel, Litchi or even Mu-12.

I just get the feeling that her tools once they are utilized fully we will have a match up that consists of timeout and maybe chip out strategy will the beam super. This match up to me seems like it will be a mix of Rachel and Litchi in one....only without the pole.

From what I've seen and read, the beam super needs to be charged for maximum damage, and it costs a hundred meter. It also has a huge start up.

Logically, the beam should be a projectile, meaning we could sledge in there, although the duration if not maximum charge might still be too much, but we can also hope that sledge will clash with it meaning we could just mash Bsledge until it finishes. That's pure Theory and assumptions on my part here.

All in all, even though Kokonoe seems like a long and tedious match up, I do not think it will be in the hardest we have. In fact, the match up could end up in our favor (I hope).

Playing Tager means being able to be the most patient one, block way too much, and punish accordingly the other player. If you don't like a match up because it's a waiting game, you might wanna reconsider why you're playing Tager. That is, if you are playing to win :D

[TD]

Graviton is probably going to make tager immobile.

[Brice]

that or walking forward will make him move ever so slightly that it's going to be not so useful... I mean, Tager still have the fastest walking speed, right?

but is that really a bad thing? she can't stop me more than 4-5 seconds until the graviton bar is depleted where as Litchi won't stop using her staff, Rachel can still throw stuff (ok there's wind but at the same time, you can just fly away and only use one so meh...) and Relius regain his wife meter way faster than Kokonoe I believe. I don't really think (for now) that the Graviton will be as terrible as it seems at first sight.

it's just going to be another way of fighting a character

[Valthazeryus]

I miss the age of Akira.

I do too. He is currently 10th Dan.

[StaSiS]

Bump!

Who's importing CP?

[NumeroGaijin]

I am borderline on importing or just waiting. Also I am glad to see Yumura up in the Dans now and playing more phenomenally than ever before

[Koopa_Klawz]

Bump!

Who's importing CP?

I am. Btw, can I add ya?

[TagerTime]

I hope to have the game next week, eventhough I hate being forced into to having to get Japanese PS3 version, I hate that you cant choose between english and japanese voice per character like newer capcom fighters and that their is no offline replays.

Also I am glad to see Yumura up in the Dans now and playing more phenomenally than ever before

I have to agree. I love this part http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYqCtNJw2NE&t=11m17s

[StaSiS]

I am. Btw, can I add ya?

As if I would say no? Lol

Sure bro. Go head

[MooMooAkai]

I much rather they make his Overdrive a bit more resourceful than just quickening the Spark Gauge. :/

So far I haven't even seen anyone use Tager's OD as more than an attempt at reversal or option select on jump in. Try 3C OD cancel into 4D. I barely see anyone abuse the fact that he gets midscreen bounces off his drive moves. Quick spark bolt is almost also never utilized. I've seen entire OD's go to waste in that regard. Japanese players seem more keen on keeping it as a defensive burst than trying to put tager in one of the only positions he cares to be in. Facing the corner.

[TagerTime]

So far I haven't even seen anyone use Tager's OD as more than an attempt at reversal or option select on jump in. Try 3C OD cancel into 4D. I barely see anyone abuse the fact that he gets midscreen bounces off his drive moves. Quick spark bolt is almost also never utilized. I've seen entire OD's go to waste in that regard. Japanese players seem more keen on keeping it as a defensive burst than trying to put tager in one of the only positions he cares to be in. Facing the corner.

Its only other main use is to do it towards the end of a combo to stack on the extra super damage from MTW>TB. The auto mag pull is so pathetically weak that it seems worthless and 720 giving magnetism is underwhelming. They dont abuse OD wallbounce combos because it will do low damage with all his drive moves having a ridiculously pathetic 72p2. So overdrive wallbounce combos so far dont seem to be worth it unless you know it will kill them. In the beginning yumurra and a couple others tried out using OD at the start of the round to get early spark but everyone stopped after a short while. It seemed like it wasnt worth it cuz the charge still to slow.

[Valthazeryus]

The real question is: What Would Akira Do?

Gonna make wristband and brand a Jesusfish on that.

[Tofu Warrior]

I'm importing, don't have a PSN account yet, just bought a PS3. I really hope it gets here this weekend.

[A.X.I.S.]

Digital release! will post Tager stuff when I get it!

[NumeroGaijin]

So far have seen from Yumura and another Tager is that maybe 5A OD might be viable thing. Don't we get 100 percent damage off of our 5A?