Rhannmah Posted February 6, 2014 Posted February 6, 2014 You can cancel 214C into the 236/623 series very early compared to when it lets you jump or do normals. Has anyone else noticed this? Actually, 214a and 214b lets you cancel the recovery in any normal or special early compared to other actions, what's weird with 214c is that it does let you cancel its recovery in any special other than sonic saber(maybe normals too? not sure). Why can't you cancel it into sonic saber? Could've been useful. What would also be useful is having the correct frame data about this, saying at what frame of recovery from teleports you can start canceling them.
Celerity Posted February 6, 2014 Posted February 6, 2014 Actually, 214a and 214b lets you cancel the recovery in any normal or special early compared to other actions, what's weird with 214c is that it does let you cancel its recovery in any special other than sonic saber(maybe normals too? not sure). Why can't you cancel it into sonic saber? Could've been useful. What would also be useful is having the correct frame data about this, saying at what frame of recovery from teleports you can start canceling them. I tested it and posted about it somewhere when the game came out, but IIRC the cancel point is something like 22F for 214A, and a little higher for the other two. 214D is much longer, nearly the full duration; 29F or so.
Rhannmah Posted February 6, 2014 Posted February 6, 2014 How does this relate to the invul frames column in the frame data for mirage thrusters? http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=Izayoi_Frame_Data_%28BBCP%29
Celerity Posted February 6, 2014 Posted February 6, 2014 It's probably cancellable right after the invuln, except for 214D.
Surf Posted February 6, 2014 Posted February 6, 2014 Why is 236B even being done on block in the first place. For stars? Thats what sabre is for. 236B isnt mixup and certainly isnt akin to any stance canceling. The only thing your going to accomplish doing it on block is showing he opponent you want to end your pressure. ALL teleports are unsafe no matter what normal or special you did before you canceled. She's like -15-20something off the damn things. Even after 6C, which is her highest level attack in normal mode. Bar 236D, which you can only do 214D afterwards. And oh you just used 3 stars. It's not even worth the cost. While it is somewhat true a person is more inclined to switch their blocking in reaction to a teleport instead of pressing a button, that doesn't make it any less safe than it already is. One thing I didn't know about is the special cancel recovery stuff on her 214s
crimsonstardust Posted February 6, 2014 Posted February 6, 2014 Well as everyone mentioned, not safe at all to do when I was testing it, my opponent wasn't even mashing 2A or anything and I got hit by stuff, though might be just cause Amane has good range in general that I got bopped by that stuff. I think opting to keep your string safe with 236A or using stance cancel is a much better way to approach Normal mode pressure. So at best it's pretty much a gimmick you can pull if your opponent is respecting you to much.
abadlime Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Does anyone remember who had harder hitboxs to land the j.BAC > ground stuff and its alternatives?
CeruleanEdge125 Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Rachel and Noel for sure. Maybe Carl and Koko as well?
Tari Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Does anyone remember who had harder hitboxs to land the j.BAC > ground stuff and its alternatives? I'm not sure what you're asking for exactly, but you might be talking about the info in the first post of the combo thread?
Stellarcircle5 Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Is there a list of the changes revealed for Izayoi in the new patch? I'm asking because I'm planning on subbing her when the patch comes out. I can't wait for this character to become the crazy mixup machine she was supposed to be.
Rhannmah Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 here are the changes up 'till now -her BnBs were sort of hard, so they’ve added more cancels and made the revolver actions connect easier. -More differences between her modes. -Gain Art mode’s “Hover Dash” can now be used in air. Movement is reverse from the ground version (from high to the ground) and stick can be used to control its movement. -Aerial backstep also changed to the same as her ground backstep, where she floats diagonally backwards -Sonic Saber now costs 2 blocks (previously 1) -Mirage Thruster now costs 1 block (previously 2) -Combining new hover dash and Mirage Thruster creates interesting movement Now, this is all fine and dandy, but it seems that everything here is made to make her mixup better, but her mixup is really great and in no need of buffs. Her main problem is actually getting in and keeping them locked down after a knockdown. Of all the new things listed, -maybe- the new controllable air dash will help with getting in, but all of those don't really address her most glaring weak points, which is her neutral game, in which you always have to keep guessing what your opponent will try to do and take chances, most of her stuff can't be done on reaction unless they're being really obvious. Her teleports also really need to be faster. And what's up with that D sonic saber nerf? I hope that's not the complete/final changes list.
Daedron Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 I hope that's not the complete/final changes list. It isn't, they either picked the most notable changes or at least a few of them and a few random ones, I guess. Still hoping for straight air sonic saber and a real DP in normal mode. ;_;
crimsonstardust Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Still hoping for straight air sonic saber and a real DP in normal mode. ;_; Well I'm not sure how an air straight sonic saber would help her, the diagonal one is fine as it is. If anything I'd like to see 623B speed up to be as fast as Jin's counter part and work as a situational DP at least. If they feel like giving her some sort of DP is cheap I think it could be made up for if she had one in GA mode where it took 2 stars or something, it would make Izayoi players maybe wanna twitch for a DP but that would also mean they have to decide if its work using stars to possibly get out of a situation, may not seem like much but considering how easy it is for to get pressured and how she's designed to build stars, I think that would make sense for her design (though I could be wrong). I'd like to see changes to Slaver Trans-am to maybe use 2 or 3 stars cause 4 is way to much even if it is an install super all I ever see it being used for is flashy combo vids with her in overdrive and I can't make Gundam jokes cause its nowhere near practical either. ):
NecroTheReaper Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Or make it an option available im both modes, but it uses 2 stars in reg and 1 in GA. This is just a brainstormed idea and its late so it might be crap lol
crimsonstardust Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Well that would kinda defeat the purpose of making it available to both modes cause you can build 2 stars back with a clean hit from a special or with 2 block strings using 236A/C in normal mode and not really worry about thinking of using DP, GA you can't build it back unless you overdrive and I'd imagine a lot of Izayoi players would want to be in GA mode as well.
Dark Ranger88 Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Why the hell does Slaver-Trans Am cost any stars to begin with? You already spend 50 heat on it AND it's not even that great of a distortion because it only lasts like 3 seconds. Even if you have a full rack of stars...you might spend one or two getting in. Then you spend a couple of stars on the combo that leads into whatever TransAm setups you have. Then TransAm takes 4. Realistically, you'll be left with 0 to 2 stars for your TransAm combo + oki afterwards. Most likely though you'll have zero or not have enough stars to use TransAm in the first place....
crimsonstardust Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Yeah I agree, its a design choice I still don't understand why they did. I was talking with a friend about this and I guess its possible ASW thought a teleport character would be too cheap or something given the track record of games like Ultimate Marvel Vs Capcom 3 where teleport characters have that strong 50 50 mix up with something covering them. Though that's a very different game where you have tools outside of character's normal tool set with assists and such and Izayoi has to do it herself so I guess they didn't think these things through very well. /: I'd kinda understand if it basically gave her Mu12 steins that shot lasers and such but they just poke people as you attack. It would be nice if it didn't take any stars to be honest, but I can see ASW still making it drain some stars and I'd be fine with it draining 2 (3 is pushing it for me) but we shall see...
Rhannmah Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) Actually, now that I think about it, a stockless Trans Am would be quite an incredible tool for getting in. For example, it would allow you to make the bits activate in mid-air for a jump-in and have them attack while coming down and guarding, forcing a block or beating anti-airs and reversals clean. It would solve many of her problems, considering she has hurtboxes on basically every part of every normal she has. Also, I really don't think she needs a meterless reversal. Actually, the less characters have one, the better off the game will be. Edited February 7, 2014 by Rhannmah
Justice7541 Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Just make it so it counts as a special hit in NM so Izayoi can knockdown, Trans Am, mode swap, rush down and rebuild. Seems fair as an oki setup for 4 stars and 50 meter. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk
Justice7541 Posted February 8, 2014 Posted February 8, 2014 Also, Best Reset Ever : Any GA air combo > Noir/Teleport reps to top of screen > j.B 9JC j.A, delay airthrow = all the hype.
NecroTheReaper Posted February 8, 2014 Posted February 8, 2014 But I posted that so long ago, and even then people already knew about it xP xD I havnt gotten use to Izayoi so is it really that useful? I've been grinding relaunch combos so I can start practicing neutral vs AI at first then move to people I cant beat.
crimsonstardust Posted February 8, 2014 Posted February 8, 2014 Well I actually messed with that before too cause my friend was telling me Rachel was able to do something like that before, what they did to make sure people don't get away with a gimmick throw set up was have the throw tech exclamation marks show up at the top of the screen around where the character would be. So basically it is possible to still throw tech it on reaction.
Dark Ranger88 Posted February 8, 2014 Posted February 8, 2014 I still say that GA noir loops out of the top of the screen > Strikefall > Astral is the coolest thing Izayoi can do. Will record if I ever land it on anyone lol.
NecroTheReaper Posted February 8, 2014 Posted February 8, 2014 I don't think it'd necessarily be that hard to do, just take forever to find that situation. Tk noir loops are probably the easiest loops in this game, so its really just the heat and hp requirements holdin ya back.
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