NecroTheReaper Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 It is a one trick pony, but its one that doesn't get better or worse despite how much time passes. There are a lot of characters that don't have a cpnstant threat of multiple mixups though. Hazama has varying ways of opening someone up. Valk has a ton of ways, with command grabs, gapless fakeouts in wolf with 5C>2/3D>5C, command grabs, IOHs with 50 heat in human mode. I think Rachel's doesn't feel as dangerous because its always gonna be the same, just changing up the rhythm. You know its there, so its not a 5 way guess between what she'll do next.
White Man Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 (edited) Forgive me if this is common knowledge (I've been absorbed in non-fighting-game things this week), but have they announced the next location test for CP 2.0 yet? EDIT: Never mind, just saw this was recently asked in the questions thread (duh). Man, they're taking their sweet time with this... Edited August 21, 2014 by White Man
StylisH Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 Well we found an answer: give tsubaki rock it. This would be awesome. Unfortunately, because it's Tsubaki they'll nerf the hell out it before you can enjoy it. I like the idea though.It is a one trick pony, but its one that doesn't get better or worse despite how much time passes. There are a lot of characters that don't have a cpnstant threat of multiple mixups though. Hazama has varying ways of opening someone up. Valk has a ton of ways, with command grabs, gapless fakeouts in wolf with 5C>2/3D>5C, command grabs, IOHs with 50 heat in human mode. I think Rachel's doesn't feel as dangerous because its always gonna be the same, just changing up the rhythm. You know its there, so its not a 5 way guess between what she'll do next. With the exception of Valkenhayn, the majority of mix ups of the cast can be dealt with depending on matchup knowledge. Valk is the exception because blocking him is damn near always the wrong decision. You're going to get hit, just depends on what you get opened up with.
Airk Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 I'm with Errol - I USED a bunch of Tsubaki's tools that got removed going from EX to CP. And the random STUPID NERFS to stuff like shield charge are awful. Basically, Errol is spot on about everything. Dreiko, sorry, but I don't think you are correct when you say nothing meaningful was lost. At all.
NecroTheReaper Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 Nerfs to weaker characters never makes sense. Isn't this what Ark prides themselves on at this point? I only played Tsubaki a few times in Ex, but would giving all her moves better hitboxes with less block push help her more than just changinf her specials around? I feel like she could also stand to have more than 1 move that's + on block standalone as she is a rushdown character with only a really slow +1 move.
Synyster17 Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 can we get more azreal buffs plz. am i the only 1 who thinks the growler change is a good idea?
StylisH Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 can we get more azreal buffs plz. am i the only 1 who thinks the growler change is a good idea? I don't know what you're on or who's supplying it, but you are getting your money's worth for sure
Verimeloni Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGpnTr50C9A Beautiful, beautiful Tsubaki combos. I miss her so much, she was fun to play. can we get more azreal buffs plz. am i the only 1 who thinks the growler change is a good idea? In the first loketest he received at least 3 buffs (Leopard/Phalanx/Gustaf) and 3 nerfs (Growler/?j.D&j.2D?/2C) so he's already in a pretty good shape.
TekkamanArk Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 How was Leopard a buff? You don't get wallbounce anymore.
Synyster17 Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 How was Leopard a buff? You don't get wallbounce anymore. i believe you do. the stick happens only in the corner i believe but i have yet to see any footage of this.
Verimeloni Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 How was Leopard a buff? You don't get wallbounce anymore. According to Kinkuli it only sticks in the corner so you can follow it up with an aerial combo.
Sashi Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 I sure hope we don't nerf Azreal and instead nerf Makoto.
Luminos564 Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 I sure hope we don't nerf Azreal and instead nerf Makoto. To be honest, I have trouble seeing Azrael weakened down to say EX/CP Makoto or CS(1) Rachel level. While I do not particularly like the change to his Growler Field (I like how he can blow away an opponent away with it simply by imitating a bear) I am not one to claim that its change is the start of his road to "suffering" (because as we all know, ASW will never change just the one thing on a given character). Then again, ASW has found ways to break an already weak Makoto down even further and made enough change to make Tager and Kanji somewhat good so I guess anything is possible.
Myoro Posted August 21, 2014 Posted August 21, 2014 Nerfs to weaker characters never makes sense. Isn't this what Ark prides themselves on at this point? I only played Tsubaki a few times in Ex, but would giving all her moves better hitboxes with less block push help her more than just changinf her specials around? I feel like she could also stand to have more than 1 move that's + on block standalone as she is a rushdown character with only a really slow +1 move. Well some nerfs make sense when you're adding a buff that would make them broken should things stay how they are. For instance, say we give Makoto the ability to follow up lvl3 5D and lvl3 j.D with a dash cancel and 2B, you would have to make lvl 3 5D or j.D harder to combo into or else Makoto would get screen carry from any hit. However if all Mak's nerfs outweighed her buffs that would be nonsensical. A character can only be so bad.
Airk Posted August 22, 2014 Posted August 22, 2014 For instance, say we give Makoto the ability to follow up lvl3 5D and lvl3 j.D with a dash cancel and 2B, you would have to make lvl 3 5D or j.D harder to combo into or else Makoto would get screen carry from any hit.I am not convinced this would make her unnecessarily good. :P She still has to hit you.
Airk Posted August 22, 2014 Posted August 22, 2014 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGpnTr50C9A Beautiful, beautiful Tsubaki combos. I miss her so much, she was fun to play.No no! We need to take away jump cancel on hit from 5C, because Tsubaki is too good to have jump loops with all the awesome buffs we gave her! Jump loops are reserved for characters who need all the help they can get like Hakumen, Jin and Hazama...
D.R.F. Posted August 22, 2014 Posted August 22, 2014 God I just remembered how much more I like cp to cs-.- ughhhh lol
TD Posted August 22, 2014 Posted August 22, 2014 Well, I don't think that Rachel's IOH is a problem. I just think that it makes her a one-dimensional character since she doesn't really have any other decent mix-up. To be overly general, Rachel is pretty much in the same boat as Tsubaki in that their move pools are both pretty mediocre, except that Rachel actually has one really good move, while Tsubaki doesn't. I think they would both benefit more from just having all their normals buffed rather than relying on gimmicks. I guess Rachel's isn't necessarily a gimmick since it works well, but she's still kind of a one-trick pony. Can you just... Just hush. Just stop talking. At least when it comes to rachel. Your posts about her are not very well informed. Rachel is an extremely dynamic character whose very combos, pressure and neutral are ever-changing. In what way is moving not one, but several projectiles and different speeds, weights and trajectories as well as moving oneself, omnidirectionally equivalent to a one trick pony. It isn't. Rachel's normals outclass tsu. She has 6a still one of the best anti airs, all her air normals minus j2c are ok, 6b, some winded normals in different situations, 236a, and Pumpkin. Pumpkin alone is Rachel's queen of the chess board. Even if she doesn't have the overhead she still has a very, very good projectile, and buffed normals could potentially be worse than the overhead as many characters already have a tough time getting through her dominant neutral game. I'm not defending her oki because it really is top strength and once on oki, games can get simplified into multiple 50-50. This has always been the case minus one unfortunate game. Confirming oki consistently is not easy for her nor is wind necessarily guaranteed on wake up. Oki outside of the corner is also not guaranteed. Valk has the same plan. So does aigis and what ever other characters exist in this damn multiverse. But from does these three their game plans tend to be dynamic, their learning curves steeper giving more chances to mess up, requiring a resource, thereby not guaranteeing oki, except for aigis basically, and the other two in the corner. I can go on and on and on about this character of whom I basically have a goddamn masters degree on, but I will stop here. I will just say that you should check what you are saying please before posting it. What impression are you giving people who really don't know about her? A bad, misinformed one. Is ja strong? Hell yes. Does it have it's weaknesses? You bet. Does it make her top tier by its lonesome? It certainly help. It would help anyone to have a strong option. But for especially rachel, by no means does it make her one directional.
StylisH Posted August 22, 2014 Posted August 22, 2014 No no! We need to take away jump cancel on hit from 5C, because Tsubaki is too good to have jump loops with all the awesome buffs we gave her! Jump loops are reserved for characters who need all the help they can get like Hakumen, Jin and Hazama... Your recent amount of awesome trolling has earned you an S rank. Keep up the good fight, sir.
Syklone Posted August 22, 2014 Posted August 22, 2014 BBCP dead game? Nerfed everything to oblivion? Is your character bad? Let's make them even worse
Verimeloni Posted August 22, 2014 Posted August 22, 2014 Your recent amount of awesome trolling has earned you an S rank. Keep up the good fight, sir. Airk is S tier but his main is B tier. That's a shame.
Stellarcircle5 Posted August 23, 2014 Posted August 23, 2014 Any more news on Valk? They want to make him a shitty Tao that runs on a meter, what else is there to show off?
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