[UNIEL] Orie

[spiralfang]

No i mean dash B

[Ginseng]

Here are some notes from a bad player such as me.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1wN3wu5IwEcQ9b-Zo4LalYq1IaPe8Obx5d5WGRK0dpOc/edit

 

 

I think dash B will mainly connect if the combo isn't scaled that much yet.

[choysauce]

if you said 66b we would've understood better. I think the same thing applies, one thing you can try is to delay the j.C so that you keep the opponent in hit stun while landing sooner

[xlolxlolx]

you delay the j.a and buffer the d.b

[spiralfang]

Oh okay im gonna hit the lab after work

[Tenryuga]

Could anyone explain how you use/input J.2C in pressure? I seem to be doing it wrong because i can't get crossups and mixups/ conversions off the persona hit.

[choysauce]

Could anyone explain how you use/input J.2C in pressure? I seem to be doing it wrong because i can't get crossups and mixups/ conversions off the persona hit.

I've been having issues with random j.C conversions, but I think you may have answered my issue! I'm gonna try to see if j.C > j.2C confirm will lead to anything substantial, in terms of damage. Also just thought of OS'ing j.C > j.214A 

 

it's tough to cross up with j.2C because of cross up protection, but you can do a gimmicky frametrap/cross up by canceling it into the j.214B and convert off of that. i think 2A is the only thing you can link off of a regular hit with the j.214B and it can be a pretty tight window to hit with.

[Button Masher]

What combo should I be trying to do after landing 22C? I'm having trouble getting damage after it and I land it a lot with mixups in the corner

[susano]

New Orie player here. Hi! -waves-

 

Is she hard to pick up? I did a few basic things with her in training and she intrigues me.

[xlolxlolx]

 

What combo should I be trying to do after landing 22C? I'm having trouble getting damage after it and I land it a lot with mixups in the corner

depends on starter but standard high low you can do a normal corner combo, off assault you'll have to go straight into 214b after a couple normals

 

New Orie player here. Hi! -waves-

 

Is she hard to pick up? I did a few basic things with her in training and she intrigues me.

she's easy to pick up but you gotta work for wins

[Loli Bacon]

I wouldn't say she's easy to pick up. She's simple, yes, but her options, routes, and confirms make her pretty -- I wouldn't say hard but she's definitely not easy. She plays like a standard Melty Blood character. I think "easy to pick up" is common in regards to Orie because she isn't executionally difficult and she doesn't have anything gimmicky that makes her mentally challenging (See: Seth for execution, Yuzu for mentally challenging).

Stuff I've been doing:

Raw 22C hit > 5C > 3C > 623A > 5A > 5C > 214B > 2C > ender
236 CH > 2C > 4C > j.B > C > j.214A |> 623A > 5A > 5C > 214B > 2C > ender
4C CH > 2C > 4C > j.B > j.C |> 623A > 5A > 5C > 214B > 2C > ender

Question: what's a better oki option other than 214B? I've noticed it's not a hard knockdown and people can air tech forward. I've primarily been doing 2C > delayed 22B as an ender just so I get free pressure afterward.

 

RPS/Theoery stuff:

B droit is CS-able even on whiff. Against people who have DP supers, she can do stuff along the lines of stuff > 236B > stuff. If you don't have the range to poke me without dashing, she can hit a button (generally 236A) to stop you from attacking back. If they call the 236A and try to DP super, she can chain shift on reaction to the super flash and be safe.

B droit on block makes a slight RPS for both parties involved. If the opponent knows I won't press a button, they'll do stuff that's slower but gives them better blockstring or advantage. If they think I'll press a button, they'll do something fast but gives a worse blockstring/advantage. Being only -6 on block, that means that unless the opponent has a move that has the range and speed to punish my poke attempt afterward, it might as well be plus on block.

For throw mixups with her, I do tk.2C > 214A > 5C > 3C > 623A > 5A > 5C > 214B > 2C > ender for combo. If j.2C hits, you get a combo. If j.2C is blocked, you still get pressure. If you know they'll block the j.2C, do j.214B. j.214B is more + on block and if they try to poke after j.2C (the attack is delayed; looks like Orie is just going to land for a split second, so promotes mashing/anti-air attempt) j.214B counterhits for a delicious combo. 66B is -2 on block and on CH gives the same combo as 3C CH with slightly less damage. 3C being -3 on block doesn't really affect her pressure at all. Mix in when you do it and spaced properly, she can 2A poke attempts. Some pressure strings I've been doing:

2AA dash 2B delay 5C 4C 2A delay 2A return to neutral 5C 5A 4C 2AA delay 2C delay 3C > stuff

[susano]

I wouldn't say she's easy to pick up. She's simple, yes, but her options, routes, and confirms make her pretty -- I wouldn't say hard but she's definitely not easy. She plays like a standard Melty Blood character. I think "easy to pick up" is common in regards to Orie because she isn't executionally difficult and she doesn't have anything gimmicky that makes her mentally challenging (See: Seth for execution, Yuzu for mentally challenging).

Stuff I've been doing:

Raw 22C hit > 5C > 3C > 623A > 5A > 5C > 214B > 2C > ender

236 CH > 2C > 4C > j.B > C > j.214A |> 623A > 5A > 5C > 214B > 2C > ender

4C CH > 2C > 4C > j.B > j.C |> 623A > 5A > 5C > 214B > 2C > ender

Question: what's a better oki option other than 214B? I've noticed it's not a hard knockdown and people can air tech forward. I've primarily been doing 2C > delayed 22B as an ender just so I get free pressure afterward.

RPS/Theoery stuff:

B droit is CS-able even on whiff. Against people who have DP supers, she can do stuff along the lines of stuff > 236B > stuff. If you don't have the range to poke me without dashing, she can hit a button (generally 236A) to stop you from attacking back. If they call the 236A and try to DP super, she can chain shift on reaction to the super flash and be safe.

B droit on block makes a slight RPS for both parties involved. If the opponent knows I won't press a button, they'll do stuff that's slower but gives them better blockstring or advantage. If they think I'll press a button, they'll do something fast but gives a worse blockstring/advantage. Being only -6 on block, that means that unless the opponent has a move that has the range and speed to punish my poke attempt afterward, it might as well be plus on block.

For throw mixups with her, I do tk.2C > 214A > 5C > 3C > 623A > 5A > 5C > 214B > 2C > ender for combo. If j.2C hits, you get a combo. If j.2C is blocked, you still get pressure. If you know they'll block the j.2C, do j.214B. j.214B is more + on block and if they try to poke after j.2C (the attack is delayed; looks like Orie is just going to land for a split second, so promotes mashing/anti-air attempt) j.214B counterhits for a delicious combo. 66B is -2 on block and on CH gives the same combo as 3C CH with slightly less damage. 3C being -3 on block doesn't really affect her pressure at all. Mix in when you do it and spaced properly, she can 2A poke attempts. Some pressure strings I've been doing:

2AA dash 2B delay 5C 4C 2A delay 2A return to neutral 5C 5A 4C 2AA delay 2C delay 3C > stuff

Well I've been doing some basic 2k with her until I get her optimal stuff down. As long as she isn't super hard, I'm willing to learn. Looking to use her to replace Hilda as a sub.

[spiralfang]

Cant go wrong with her shes solid but she just lacks a fireball lol but shes has good oki and shes rewarding when your willing to work for it

[susano]

Cant go wrong with her shes solid but she just lacks a fireball lol but shes has good oki and shes rewarding when your willing to work for it

Yep.

[Rhiya]

AND YOU GET TO WATCH NISHINE FOR MATCHVIDS
 

(I actually like watching Nishine more than Jikangire, Katou, or Fuse's Linnes)

[susano]

AND YOU GET TO WATCH NISHINE FOR MATCHVIDS

 

(I actually like watching Nishine more than Jikangire, Katou, or Fuse's Linnes)

 

Oooh, oki.

[choysauce]

Has anyone explored the utility on Orie's force function? I can only see it being useful for using with Thanatos and for random cross up setups. But I can see it being useful against merkava when he starts to fly, since you can get up higher in the air with it and then assault j.C

[iFaiska]

Could anyone explain how you use/input J.2C in pressure? I seem to be doing it wrong because i can't get crossups and mixups/ conversions off the persona hit.

The only requirement is that the opponent have to be in crouch state. (You can still crossup then if they are standing, you just have to delay quite a bit the j2c after you jump ,but i don't think it's that good)

 

Anyway:

 

*Do a fast tk [9]j2c and you will crossup, as soon as the j2c hit do a j214b, you should land in the same side you "started". (I think this j214b can be guarded both ways can only be guarded if you mantain guard initial direction ).

 

*Delay just a bit the tk[9]j2c(or the tk[9]j2c into j214b cancel) and you should "true crossup" and land behind the opponent. (i think this option, the opponent have to change his guard for the j214b, don't need to change guard direction at all).

 

Easy Confirm ->...land, 5A or 2A, 5C, 4C, jB, ,jC. j214A, 623A, 5A, 3B, 214B, 2C, Ender/Summon

 

OBS1: this combo will only work if the j214b hit the opponent, but if the j214b is guarded, you can maintain pressure.

 

Damage Confirm ->...land, 5C, 2C, 4C, jB, ,jC. j214A, 623A, 5A, 3B, 214B, 2C, Ender/Summon

 

OBS1: land, "gap", 5C. this gap is susceptible to some reversals.

 

Hit the training room, put your dummy to crouch state and be happy. (check both guarded and unguarded tkj2C, i think properties changes.)

 

==========================================================================

 

 

PS: Whoever posted the Chain Shift, 236 combo, you have my thanks.

[Loli Bacon]

The only requirement is that the opponent have to be in crouch state. (You can still crossup then if they are standing, you just have to delay quite a bit the j2c after you jump ,but i don't think it's that good)

 

Anyway:

 

*Do a fast tk [9]j2c and you will crossup, as soon as the j2c hit do a j214b, you should land in the same side you "started". (I think this j214b can be guarded both ways).

 

*Delay just a bit the tk[9]j2c(or the tk[9]j2c into j214b cancel) and you should "true crossup" and land behind the opponent. (i think this option, the opponent have to change his guard for the j214b, but i'm not sure).

 

Easy Confirm ->...land, 5A, 5C, 4C, jB, ,jC. j214A, 623A, 5A, 3B, 214B, 2C, Ender/Summon

 

OBS1: this combo will only work if the j214b hit the opponent, but if the j214b is guarded, you can maintain pressure.

 

Damage Confirm ->...land, 5C, 2C, 4C, jB, ,jC. j214A, 623A, 5A, 3B, 214B, 2C, Ender/Summon

 

OBS1: land, "gap", 5C. this gap is susceptible to some reversals.

 

Hit the training room, put your dummy to crouch state and be happy. (check both guarded and unguarded tkj2C, i think properties changes.)

 

==========================================================================

 

 

PS: Whoever posted the Chain Shift, 236 combo, you have my thanks.

 

j.2C > j.214B doesn't combo. j.2C > j.214A does. You're gonna have to guess whether they get hit by j.2C or if they'll block it, as that'll affect which follow up you do.

[iFaiska]

j.2C > j.214B doesn't combo. j.2C > j.214A does. You're gonna have to guess whether they get hit by j.2C or if they'll block it, as that'll affect which follow up you do.

 

Yeah i know, i was talking about the mixup. 

Watch out for 5a mash, j2c into j214b isn't even a true blockstring. If you're having this problem, you can do the "same side version" and change j214b for j214a to get a counterhit. Was going to add this bit, but forgot it midway.

You don't have to worry about j2c hitting or not, since like you said it's doesn't combo. What i said about properties changes, i was referring about the pushback.

Edit:

This is what i'm talking about, "same side" -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cPwziF-kxnw#t=2m36s

This video have both version of the mixup. -> He only does the "same side" version, with is kinda weird. The seth player got hit a lot, maybe it's really a true cross up even if it is the "same side" with if true... will be very, very nice. I will post the "behind" when i find it.

Edit(Again): About the properties i was talking about, it only happens if they block tkj2c AND you're running, you keep momentum and most likely land behind. ( if you want to do the "same side" mix, make sure you're not running, or you'll always land behind).

[Psykotik]

The tk j.2C > j.214B string is not a real mixup, crossup protection will let you block both sides by holding back. It looks rather deceptive so it'll catch people who aren't used to seeing it.

 

Has anyone explored the utility on Orie's force function? I can only see it being useful for using with Thanatos and for random cross up setups. But I can see it being useful against merkava when he starts to fly, since you can get up higher in the air with it and then assault j.C

 

You can cancel into her FF from normals, making it a janky jump cancel of sorts. I've used it to dodge Seth's orb while pressuring him. The extra height you get from the FF might be useful in getting around zoning if your opponent's not prepared to cover that angle. It's not the safest or most reliable tool IMO but it's there if you feel like burning a GRD stock.

Edited August 26, 2014 by Psykotik

[iFaiska]

The tk j.2C > j.214B string is not a real mixup, crossup protection will let you block both sides by holding back. It looks rather deceptive so it'll catch people who aren't used to seeing it.

You're absolutely right.

I just tested with a friend online, and he said if you don't release back, you will be safe... for both options of landing (i was hoping the "behind" would be a true crossup... no dice), i got him with it a few times in matches after the test.

His feedback: It will only work if you think you should(as often happens since tkj2c will make you land behind then) change guard direction and release "back", you will get hit. But like Psykotik said, if you know it's comming it's easier to block. It's more or less a gimmick, still good to know.

[pochp]

22c blocked into mixup combos, kind of unstable, any better alternatives?

 

(22c) 6d j.a step back jump forward delay j.b j.c 3b 214b 2186

(22c) 2c wait 5c j.a j.b j.c 3b 214b 2c 4c 214b 3212

 

 

Another nice thing to note about B+C is that if your back is to the corner and you manage to get your opponent to block a normal, if you cancel a normal into it you should land on the other side and put them in the corner. Also, unlike assault, you can still chain and cancel normals from it, so stuff like j.a j.214b is still there.

[Psykotik]

For j.A:

 

(22c) 6D j.A, (22C ends) delay 2C, 5C, 3B, 214B, 2C, (ender)

 

For lows, you can probably the same combo above off a 2A. Off 2C, you could try:

 

(22c) 2C, wait, 5C, 3C, 623A, 5A, 5C, 214B, 2C, (ender)

 

Disclaimer: I actually don't even know if the latter combo works (it probably does, but who knows), I just thought of it on the spot. Can't test it right now but I'd think that it would do more damage if it works.

Edited August 27, 2014 by Psykotik

[iFaiska]

More findings about tkj2c. (I found the record dummy[Duh!!], so i could test for myself and get more acurate informations, i guess i was a bit to hasty to judge)

I guess i forgot one option in this "mixup"(or 2 if you count "counter mash option", but i have pointed that before). "Raw tkj2c, land , 2a", this option will actualy hit if the opponent don't change def after tkj2c.

The "same side" version will hit if the opponet try changing guard direction, the "behind" can be guarded both sides, and the raw tkj2c into 2a, will hit if opponent don't change guard after tkj2c.

In summary:

Tkj2c, j214b(same side) -> Can only be guarded if you mantain guard initial direction, beats low profile mashing, can be mashed by most characters 5a, can be reversaled after tkj2c(have to guess the side though), shield can mess j214b timing.

Tkj2c, delay, j214b(behind) -> Can be guarded both ways, beats low profile mashing, can be mashed by most characters 5a, shield can mess j214b timing, can be reversaled after tkj2c(have to guess the side though).

Tkj2c, land, 2a -> Will hit if opponent don't change def after tkj2c, can be mashed, tkj2c punishable on shield(they have to guess will not j214b though), can bait reversal if you don't 2a and just guard.

I guess this covers the main options. The only reliable way to counter this mix is to do a fast 5a after tkj2c, it will beat any of those 3 options, the others punishers, while they might work, they are very risky(have to guess sides, overhead and baits) since j214b is one of Orie best starter combo.

So, we still have that one more option tkj2c, j214a(don't delay it), wich will beat mash and get you a counter hit j214a. (still sucesptible to reversal after tkj2c)