Shinjin Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 6C>66 is -4 fastest jab in the game = 5F which means 6C>66> DP or backstep or 2A you can make opponent to guess how much - is it with (the easymode)IB then? Edit: Not that it matters, im just curious how IB in this game works.
PozerWolf Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 i translated the jin data in pozer's links Edited post. So I'm looking through the Frame Date and some of it seems a bit incorrect or a bit off. I had a long rant I wanted to post of the errors that may been shown in the data last night, but as soon as I went to bed and had a wet dream about some anime called Spice and Wolf while listening to the Gundam Seed OST, I woke up in a pool of white water and I completely forget what the errors in the data were. Ah, hopefully I remember. Nothing big, nor was there many. But it was enough to PISS ME OFF!!!! Grrrrrrrrr, I'm mad at everything!
render Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 6C>66 is -4 fastest jab in the game = 5F which means 6C>66> DP or backstep or 2A you can make opponent to guess So 6C>66 is safe on block by 1 frame? Jin's DPs are throw-invincible, right? What's the startup on jumps?
stunedge Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 IB is insanely good in this game reduce 5F block frame on the ground and 10F block frame in the air pretty much nothing is safe against IB in this game both 623C and 623D are throw invincible from first frame and considering most throw in this game is 7F 623B will also work since it's invincible from 6F and gets the bigger return than 623C Jin's jump is 5F
Hellmonkey Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 btw i only did the notes for the frame data, vet/zinac did the rest hopefully we can get it all organized like gg's data is.
PozerWolf Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 So yeah, 2D does a lot of damage. Why do people do combos like: * 5C (CH) > 6C > Dash Cancel > 5C > SJ > j.C > j.D > Pause > Air Dash > j.B > j.C > Ice Ride When something like... * 5C (CH) > 6C > 2D > Run Up > 5C > 2C > SJ > j.B > j.C > JC > j.C > Ice Ride Does like 300 more points of damage and they both end in knock down? The only time I would see the first combo useful is if you added to many hits to where your trying to link the Ice Ride after 11 hits. Like if you did 2A > 2A > 5B (1 hit) > [into first combo] then it would make sense. But otherwise adding a Ground D move always seems like the best situation. Also, why isn't the whole "if I hit you with this move you can air tech earlier" properties listed on the mook? That's lame. 6D has it to where if the opponents are hit by it, they can air tech a Hit sooner (in other words you would have to remove a certain move out of your combo if your trying to score knockdown if you land a 6D once). Samething with EX Ice Ride, if you do it twice then you start seeing them air tech sooner than usual. I'm assuming it should go along something like 6D removes 1 hit and EX Ice Ride removes half-a-hit. I dunno, stuff like that should have been listed in the mook. Actually, does the mook have any combos listed like they did in last month's Arcadia? Those combos were kind of neat. Looking back at my post, maybe this was my rant? I JUST DON'T KNOW ANYMORE!!!
stunedge Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 "Proration Pt." on the frame data is sth related to tech time 2 things affect tech time in this game is the time elapsed since the first hit of the combo and this "Proration Pt." , the higher the point is, the easier opponent can tech it tech time also decreases every 3sec, 5sec, 7sec .... since the combo started entire 6D motion is much longer than the ride, thats why it is easier to tech 6D >>* 5C (CH) > 6C > Dash Cancel > 5C > SJ > j.C > j.D > Pause > Air Dash > j.B > j.C > Ice ppl do this combo since you land in the lower position at the end of the combo which means you have better situation to do okizeme it's actually the personal preference of choosing damage or the situation but apparently most Jin player on the vids prefer the latter one
H-F Blade Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 Just so I'm understanding this correctly, the 2 hits of ice ride do NOT combo if your current combo is at 11 hits? Or will the second hit of ice ride not combo if the total combo count ends at 11? I was always wondering why that was the case and it doesn't really make much sense. :|
PozerWolf Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 "Proration Pt." on the frame data is sth related to tech time 2 things affect tech time in this game is the time elapsed since the first hit of the combo and this "Proration Pt." , the higher the point is, the easier opponent can tech it tech time also decreases every 3sec, 5sec, 7sec .... since the combo started entire 6D motion is much longer than the ride, thats why it is easier to tech 6D Oh wow, didn't realize time was in effect as well. Interesting to know, but lame to know that such a feature exists!! GUARRRRH!!! >>* 5C (CH) > 6C > Dash Cancel > 5C > SJ > j.C > j.D > Pause > Air Dash > j.B > j.C > Ice ppl do this combo since you land in the lower position at the end of the combo which means you have better situation to do okizeme it's actually the personal preference of choosing damage or the situation but apparently most Jin player on the vids prefer the latter one That's dumb seeing as how you can play basically the same exact Oki game. But then again his Oki game fuckin' suckkkssss!!!! I mean yeah he has tricks, BUT WHO DOESEN'T!! Pfft, Jin players. Do more damage, get the same oki. DUHHHHH!! Just so I'm understanding this correctly, the 2 hits of ice ride do NOT combo if your current combo is at 11 hits? Or will the second hit of ice ride not combo if the total combo count ends at 11? I was always wondering why that was the case and it doesn't really make much sense. :| 2nd hit if Ice Ride would whiff if your air combo is too long.
stunedge Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 Just so I'm understanding this correctly, the 2 hits of ice ride do NOT combo if your current combo is at 11 hits? Or will the second hit of ice ride not combo if the total combo count ends at 11? I was always wondering why that was the case and it doesn't really make much sense. :| it doesnt matter how many hits it is more depending on your general combo time
PozerWolf Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 I don't know if "Proration Pt" has anything to do with the tech time as well. Seeing as how that would be lame if there were 2 properties preventing the combos to be so tamed.
stunedge Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 some equations P = point accumulated D = decrease of the tech time ignore the negative value ground: D = (P-25000) / 3600 (F) air: D = (P-16000) / 3600 (F) P also increases by 100 every single frame
PozerWolf Posted March 11, 2009 Posted March 11, 2009 some equations P = point accumulated D = decrease of the tech time ignore the negative value ground: D = (P-25000) / 3600 (F) air: D = (P-16000) / 3600 (F) P also increases by 100 every single frame Well I'm sure I stated that if it is a timed based thing, then well... yeah...
shtkn Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 in the frame data, it says Jin's 6B is high inv., which is false, it's low inv.
Mike Z Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 Does the tech-time decrease stuff also apply to freeze-length decrease? If not, seems that it's much better to do freezes later in combos...
PozerWolf Posted March 12, 2009 Posted March 12, 2009 Does the tech-time decrease stuff also apply to freeze-length decrease? If not, seems that it's much better to do freezes later in combos... I don't think so, or it does not seem so when I freeze opponents at the end of a combo. However, to catch an opponent in a freeze torward the end of the combo is just as tuff as catching them with Ice Ride (it's easier to land a freeze move, but not by much).
render Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 Can we edit the first post and wiki so Fubuki isn't described as a mist finer? I think it's a little misleading. What have people been using for tech traps? (Am I even using the right term? haha) After knockdown, I'll often put out a 5B to snag opponents who are recovering late (neutral) or forward (towards me), and just started using 2C last night to catch forward techs. Was thinking 5D might be good to catch forward and back techs, but it feels a little unsafe.
kid viper Posted March 20, 2009 Posted March 20, 2009 you can also use standing b to catch people trying to roll behind you. if you've done a combo into the D ice ride you can use 2B to hit them then jump cancel. if they tech you have the option to grab them or you can mix in the air hishougeki (3 projectiles). if you start seeing people who like to roll away from you all the time you can also use 2D as the roll leaves them right on top of where the sword comes out for a freeze.
TheSlyMoogle Posted March 21, 2009 Posted March 21, 2009 Can we edit the first post and wiki so Fubuki isn't described as a mist finer? I think it's a little misleading. What have people been using for tech traps? (Am I even using the right term? haha) After knockdown, I'll often put out a 5B to snag opponents who are recovering late (neutral) or forward (towards me), and just started using 2C last night to catch forward techs. Was thinking 5D might be good to catch forward and back techs, but it feels a little unsafe. Hmm I've been throwing a lot of well timed 5c to catch rolls and techs. It's active for quite a while and it's big. Plus if you catch rolls with you easily get a 6C afterwards since rolls leave characters in a crouch state.
render Posted March 21, 2009 Posted March 21, 2009 Hmm I've been throwing a lot of well timed 5c to catch rolls and techs. It's active for quite a while and it's big. Plus if you catch rolls with you easily get a 6C afterwards since rolls leave characters in a crouch state. Sick, I'll try that out. It's a little slow to recover, though - you don't get punished for it when people neutral tech? And thanks for the ideas kid viper - I'll give those a shot.
PozerWolf Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 I'm kind of surprised that the combos from arcadia have not been translated and posted here. The Jin mook has some interesting combos and tips as well. It's a nice read IF YOU UNDERSTAND MOON SPEAK!! FUCK!!!! But yeah, if anyone is interested I can go ahead and post some translations once I got time. Or if anything, if anyone here would like to share there info on the guide book or arcadia artical, that'd be great. Also, don't use 2D as a roll tech trap. That's the most retarded thing anyone can ever do because it will work once, and only once in a match... PEROID!!!!
TheSlyMoogle Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 Sick, I'll try that out. It's a little slow to recover, though - you don't get punished for it when people neutral tech? And thanks for the ideas kid viper - I'll give those a shot. Well you have a lot of time to cancel 5c to 5d so if they neutral tech just do that. Normally pushes them too far away to punish. You can also give them a 214 A after 5d and that will normally keep them from trying to counterpoke you or anything. I'm kind of surprised that the combos from arcadia have not been translated and posted here. The Jin mook has some interesting combos and tips as well. It's a nice read IF YOU UNDERSTAND MOON SPEAK!! FUCK!!!! But yeah, if anyone is interested I can go ahead and post some translations once I got time. Or if anything, if anyone here would like to share there info on the guide book or arcadia artical, that'd be great. I'm very interested in this moonspeak combo translation you speak of.
PozerWolf Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 I'm very interested in this moonspeak combo translation you speak of. Well, it's nothing like "OMFG AMAZING COMBOS MUST LEARN!!" there more like "Oh that was kind of neat... FOR ME TO STEAL!!" kind of combos. Plus they give some nice tips like how Jin has shitty anti-airs and that he's a joke because you can jump on him for free. And that his over-head cannot be super canceled and has little to no range, so try not to miss with it (no really, it says stuff like this... sort of). Can't really say it had any AWESOME advice. For some reason the Arcadia artical was making a huge deal out of 6B on Counter Hit. It was like "Holy fuck guys, did you know 6B CH leads into 6C? WTF BROKEN, BANNED IN ALL TOURNAMENTS!!" kind of thing. I dunno, Japan is strange. I guess I'll go ahead and translate some combos and go ahead and share my combos to the WORLD!!!!!
render Posted March 24, 2009 Posted March 24, 2009 If they neutral tech the 5C's gonna whiff. Not sure how you propose canceling into 5D from a whiffed 5C. Pozerwolf - I'd be happy to help w/ the trans. Are there links to the articles and/or mook pages? I haven't even seen them.
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