[CS2] Ragna General Discussion

[Yggjrasil]

Props to you for using Conan as a reference :3. No what I'm saying is gimmicks are nice in all but what good are they if they're unsafe? I don't mean to sound like an asshole or anything I'm saying 5D(1) dash cancel is too much risk for what its worth, I mean if it's a weird frame for it to cancel and its really dangerous against before with good defense. I'm sure, most people at first don't see it coming,but what about those who mash at ANY GAPS in your blockstrings? (and yes I have fought people who mashed out of my pressure I'm talking straight up "don't respect your pressure worth a damn",that shit is annoying as hell. 720 w/o IB,Houtenjin,2A,Yukikaze)

Edited December 3, 2010 by Yggjrasil

[bojador_pt]

What's a good follow up for this: 5B, 5C, 2D, HF(1) RC ...?

And what if 5B hits as counter hit?

[WolfCrimson]

Against mashers (which is not a pro strat, kids!), do what you would do if you were thinking of performing any normal blockstring that's not airtight. I.e. don't do 'em, or maybe incorporate a C ID into the gap to stop them mashing (anti-masher strat). It's no different from any blockstring that's unsafe. It's not really an issue if people don't mash, which pro players don't do. Plus, normally, a 5D (1) non-IB blockstun is enough to cover the gap between the first and second hits. People who know what's what and didn't IB the second hit wouldn't mash.

Edited December 3, 2010 by WolfCrimson

[VR-Raiden]

What's a good follow up for this: 5B, 5C, 2D, HF(1) RC ...?

And what if 5B hits as counter hit?

I dunno about the first one, 2D doesn't combo to HF. Do you mean 2D, 5C, HF?

As for CH 5B, I tried stuff with it a while back but don't remember finding anything too useful. If I recall correctly, it combos to GH which could get you a bit more damage on a far hit than 5B, 5C, HF. Up close, nothing was better than just going into 3C or whatever you would do on normal hit. If you land an air CH 5B, you have time to do another 5B into combo.

[WolfCrimson]

^Warning: Never do 2 5b's in one combo, especially in the beginning of it. Same move proration hurts like hell. Try to net a 2C after air hit CH 5B if you can, or maybe revolver it straight into 6A.

[VR-Raiden]

^Warning: Never do 2 5b's in one combo, especially in the beginning of it. Same move proration hurts like hell. Try to net a 2C after air hit CH 5B if you can, or maybe revolver it straight into 6A.

Yeah those would be optimal for sure. Just saying in case you don't hit confirm to cancel into other stuff, 5B still connects even if you wait for the CH 5B to fully recover (don't remember if anything better does), that's what's different about it being a CH.

but I guess it being CH would also give you more time to cancel into something better, so the fact that it is CH helps whether you cancel into stuff or not.

Edited December 3, 2010 by VR-Raiden

[bojador_pt]

I'm sorry for the confusion. This is what I meant:

5B, 5C, 2C, HF(1) RC...

5B (CH), 5C, 2C, HF (1) RC...

I was under the impression CH on the start of a combo would give you more untechable frames so you could do things like 5D loop, that's why I asked.

[Nakkiel]

Hell's Fang is really bad proration-wise, you're actually making virtually any combo worse by using it early on.

The only times a CH makes the rest of the combo have more untechable frames is Fatal Counters, so only 2C CH will work for Ragna.

[bojador_pt]

So what you're saying is that I should do the follow up for the HF instead of wasting 50% heat to RC and continue the combo?

Bear in mind that I'm doing the HF because I'm out of range for 3C or 5D.

[Final Ultima]

If you really deem it necessary to use the Heat, something like 6C (DC) or 5D (DC) into 6A (HJC), air combo etc will work just fine.

[Legend Of K1]

okay so.....I have a question regarding combos and such....

any time im in a match, it seems like everything i do leads to the same combo:

5B, 5C, 5D, dc 6A, j.C, j.D, jc j.C, B Edge, 6DD, B Edge, 5D > finisher

either that ^ or if im spaced too far: 5B, 5C, hells fang > HF follow up

is my first combo even an ideal combo to be using ? is there any real need to incorporate many different combos into my game ? my mixup is fine, its just that it seems like every hit confirm leads to one of the above combos.

Thanks <3

[advancedNoob]

you could always play mind games with HF, by trading the second hit for a reset. But if you really are looking to spend heat and do some damage, I prefer to use CS instead of HF.

[FlyingVe]

Pretty much everything Ragna does leads into a double or single BE.

Ragna has lots of potential combos, but none are as good as double BE. There is some variety in how you end your BE, since there are many tricks that can be used. Also, try as hard as you can to stick 3C in your BnB, then you can end with 5D>22C for better damage (usually) and oki.

[Legend Of K1]

you mean using 3C in place of 5C at the beginning ? that will allow me to follow up my last 5D with 22C ?

[FlyingVe]

Depending on range you could. However, 3C>2B>5C>(JC) is more stable and gives you a nice hit-confirm off 3C. Damage is a smidge lower though.

[WolfCrimson]

K1: He means that at any point prior to the 22C part of the combo, you should have knocked down an opponent with a 2D or a 3C for it (the 22C) to work. Like, for example: 5B>2C>3C>2B>5C>JC>j.C>j.D>JC>j.C>BE>5D>22C. There's a 3C (bolded) in the combo that knocks them down, which would allow them to be 22Ced later in the combo. The same is true for 2D.

[Beautiful Death]

Remember that you can't do a 3C combo of any worth if you're starting from double jabs. But anything else is for the most part double belial 22C ender territory. Lord I can't wait for the patch. I think.

22C for the most part is just something you do if you can. Like, if you got the knockdown from 2D or 3C, DO IT. 400 damage is a lot when everything is prorated to hell.

Unless you're doing like, Bloody Kain. That's different.

Edited December 4, 2010 by Beautiful Death

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

Damnit Final, stop stealing my secrets when I'm not looking!

But only I still know the anywhere-on-the-screen versions, haha! =D

[Final Ultima]

Well, to be fair, the first one I posted was anywhere on screen.

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

True, but the setup I'm talking about will work off of anything. Gauntlet Hades, Throw, Airthrow, 5B-6A, you name it. Pretty much any combo that doesn't normally allow 22C, from anywhere on the screen, with a handful of exceptions.

[Final Ultima]

Well then, share the wealth. I didn't experiment extensively but my go-to setups wouldn't work off a few things because they'd tech between the j.B and j.C. Maybe I'm just trying too hard to get good damage off of it, I dunno.

[jiyuna]

I come from the future. Quit Ragna now before it's too late.

[soujiro seta]

I come from the future. Quit Ragna now before it's too late.

Lol, jiyuna isn't it a bit too early say that. Besides, you should bring hope, not panic. I saw your irc and rotflmao at how strong tager is now.

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

Well then, share the wealth. I didn't experiment extensively but my go-to setups wouldn't work off a few things because they'd tech between the j.B and j.C. Maybe I'm just trying too hard to get good damage off of it, I dunno.

I will, I was just kinda hanging onto all my setups for a video. But the truth is that I have no capture equipment and no experience making vids, so I might as well share what I figured out.

It really sucks that these setups only work on 4 characters, cuz the combos are really cool and useful.

[-Ladon-]

combo

I have a feeling this will work on my quad 2C combo, lemme go check

well I couldn't reproduce it, feels like they're teching too fast after the TK CID

if you can reproduce it, combo is:

corner, near opponent

2c-2c-6c-dc-2c-5d(1)-GH-2c-5D-dc-6A-jc-j.C-j.D-j.C-BE-6A-TK CID

then it seems to blue beat before I get in range for j.C pickup, you guys might have the timing down better than me though

combo does about 5.2k with D ID ender, I'd imagine 5.5k with 22C pickup

Edited December 10, 2010 by -Ladon-