reaVer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zb5w1Ibm8kY third round http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gL8cm8uUYSQ third round

Lets just keep it at: its not as fearsome to OS as it might be to other characters XD Two anonymous Sanma victims. If OS did his jump right, you cannot throw him if you evade the j.H, he can jump or counterthrow before that. If you got someone that keeps doing it wrong, that is his problem.

No, I don't fuck that stuff up as often as it happened. Especially when I expect my opponent to attack me like that.

Ky's IAD.H or Greed Sever in that case:P (And I was guarding high)

Then explain to me how I'm getting hit out of a successful GF FRC :P Tbh I think RC and FRC do have several frames of recovery.

Slayer would fall off the screen performing BBU because the stages are too small. And when he DoTs he'll do the same. I'd say OS would do better because he can walk to a corner and throw people away, and when they bounce back he can slap them away again.

Too much to quote. Anyways, if you're airthrowing an OS consistently that OS player is a moron, you don't have N-O skills. OS's basic jump is pretty much unthrowable. I'm not quite sure, but I think OS can get better rewards against 6H rather than just a SV. Oh well, if OS is lazy he'll use SV yeah. OS is not required to jump at Venom to get in, if you whiff anything with no balls out OS can Ri in, tag you for +3 and start an offensive, varying from fafnir to throws. If you actually use stinger aim be sure to FRC it or you'll eat a j.H on counterhit, and yes OS will IAD to make that happen. When OS jumps at you you can 6P, but he can doublejump it, so you'll have to mix with delays and stuff. Backdashing OS's j.H from his basic jump is pointless as OS goes from an offensive state to a neutral state immediately: it ends up being neutral or slightly in Venom's advantage on the charts, but any close situation is always in OS's favor, even if it isn't. "jH - beats most of OS shit" except when OS is actually paying attention, any jump against OS is j.Pable, use this move too often and he'll start j.Ping away, oh and he can crash land on you if you didn't jump with j.H via option select. For the ground moves again, if you whiff them with no balls flying towards OS, he'll just race back in with Ri, you're going to have to sweep or something like that and you don't like what he's got in store for that. Dunno what DHM S means. There's only a few reasons for OS to use SVs, to skim your offense isn't one of them. Any good OS will only SV when your body is in range or you have been poking in his nose in every semi neutral situation. Reasons for OS to SV are to end your pressure(remember he'll mix this up), to punish close range TK attack attempts and to punish throw attempts. OS has no reason against Venom to use it as a firewall since Venom's whiffed pokes suck so much already:P Corner pressure: don't do it, you'll die; he can pretty much do whatever he pleases against you to get out varying from SVing to FD+IGing. If you keep doing 2S S-ball repeat he can IG the ball, 1F jump your ass(forward of course) and knock you on the head with j.H. You're not off that bad with the combo, there's 1 or 2 venoms that took the j.H from starting position at the start of the round and the round was pretty much over after that. Trying to bait OS on his own jumping range doesn't work too well on experienced OS players, even if they fall for it once, they will not fall for it again. Now that I'm done with the annoying part, lets start with the good stuff XD OS can do rushdown and a bit of runaway(but not that well), if there's one thing he cannot do, its zoning. What you want to do with Venom is make him guess where he can and cannot move and preferably give him the idea that he cannot move anywhere at all. A simple P-ball 5P vs P-ball 6P mixup helps immensely with that. If OS wants to move by the ground you force him in the air by shooting balls at him directly(keep the D-ball in handy in case he tries to GB-sneak his way in), while in the air you use 6P to counter his basic jump in or delayed 6P to counter his doublejump in. UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES TRY TO INTERCEPT OS, VENOM CANNOT DO IT, also staying above OS doesn't warrant your safety: SV becomes safe, you set yourself up for AA GB shenanigans and even stuff like a simple 5H can kill you if you guessed (your j.H for example) wrong. It can happen that you're no longer left with enough space to do ballsummons, in that case zone carefully only do moves to hit OS, not to get them guarded or whiffed, because if you do he can turn the situation around really quickly. If you somehow make the wrong choice(OS made the right one) and he ends up closer to you, you can either BS your way out, or... BS your way out or die. Once OS gets momentum on you, you are dead. There isn't really such a thing as punishing his pressure since all his stuff leaves him at advantage or very minor disadvantage. There's moments where OS can choose to dash, anticipating those situations is your best bet on getting out; at the same time, its also your best bet in eating a CH for over 50% life combo. OS can use any move as such a setup, but the general ones are CC, l1&2BHB, l1Ri, l2-3BRP, 2S and 2P; l3BHB doesn't belong in this list as that will always be a closed gap, which you can't do anything in. With l3BHB OS is keen on playing overhead vs low game on you, he'll have to wait till after the l3BHB to throw you. Having experienced the Venom matchup quite a bit, I wouldn't really say Venom vs OS is a 5.5 - 4.5 matchup for Venom. OS has a lot of ways to bullshit Venom while Venom lacks the actual tools to counter that bullshit. Oh, this is fairly minor but anyways: do not chase your DAs to melee OS, he will just IG it and DAA you if you do that.

A better one: Perfection cannot be achieved. But there's nothing wrong striving for it:P

Yes, I will always find something to bitch about, my own stuff, others' stuff, everything will fall victim to my bitching wrath XD Striving for perfection is what I do best:P

No, its to point out people can actually reversal backdash these days, not that its their best option. EDIT: reread, slidehead loop -> giganter loop aka knockdown giganter, slidehead, fake hammerfall 5K2S2H HK repeat. Most characters need to reversal backdash the giganter, or use DAA, afaik only OS glitches out of it. Again, put it in the vids XD It makes the whole thing look more alive; ALIVE!!!

Well, getting a reversal SV isn't that hard and thanks to Potemkin slidehead loop people in Japan learned how to properly reversal backdash. Latif: show that stuff in the vid! :P

Put J-pop in it and I WILL complain! Muhahahaha:P

And I've also seen it done in a Japanese match, they do it but not often, probably because its very easy to escape(backdash, uppercuts, outside meaty j.IG). JackG: I didn't say it was boring, I said it seemed what Eddies were already doing and some stuff even seems mandatory.

Guess I should try it then XD

Do you actually hit Sol when he doesn't VV?

2H and rj backdash can get you VVed, especially because they are so nicely telegraphed(and yeah, VV hits at that range). SV is not usable for offense, so don't use it on someone's wakeup, even if he VVs... 5H only works on if he does the kick extension after it. Oh and when baiting it, be sure to sit outside throw range XD

Fading out isn't that major issue, but fading in from the book is like "Hey where the hell are the characters? Oh, the combo started already, blegh!". The combos/setups don't have to be all super funky or anything, but the setups look kinda textbook: what happens when people actually try to escape the unblockable? As for combo innovation, not every "combo" vid has a lot of it, there's several out there that look good because of the setups that are being used(non-Eddie) instead of the actual combos(Promise(OS), Nostalgia(JO)). I dunno, but the stuff I saw here is kinda like "weren't you supposed to be doing that with Eddie already?", heck perhaps it is that good:P And I thought you did play Baiken XD

The editing confused me in some manner, its kinda like you're not able to see in what situation the combo is started often enough or ended for that matter. And aren't most of these the standard Eddie combos or am I watching the wrong matchvids? O_O

You can SV VV and you will beat it, unless he launches it several frames later than you do: he has less invincibility on VV than you do on SV. To get out of his attack strings, watch for holes, that's where his mixup will start, if his mixup fails, you get out.

It depends on how you want to play with Sol really, Kusoru does weird shit but often enough for good reasons, he's like the man with the iron balls so to speak. Others are simply more conservative.

Because if you're fast enough you're getting a DP really low by doing 6923 or 62369. And those 2 are a lot less likely to fail or whiff since you're jumping forward rather than backwards. Hmmm, thinking about the buffer, I should try 923...

k If your opponent has 25% tension, don't use 6P except for meaty. Riot Stomp is FRCable and then it goes into GV or sweep, if you're standing there doing 6P you'll just look silly. Best thing I found is to chase him to the wall and SV him before he gets the chance to land. He'll be able to tech but his options from there on are limited. 6P vs GF is pretty much same story, though less likely to happen. Considering your own defensive and offensive capabilities in air its better to just jump over it by jumping backward and then doublejumping forward. If he chases for 5K2H into combo you should be able to smack him on the head. So these were just a few scenarios, to play against Sol, the primary thing you'll have to keep in mind is that he has more range and has relatively high priority for his range, so you'll often going to be blocking(if you don't you eat 200 damage, so you will). At this point he'll be hacking away at you and you just guarding his shite taking every damage opportunity he leaves for you and he'll probably realize that unless he breaks your guard he's going to lose. So what he has to do is get in and play a normal vs throw game to break your guard. Here there is two choices: you play his game by guarding and jumping/backdashing accordingly or you enforce your own game, which means making him guess whether you'll SV or not. The choice of which you're doing doesn't really matter imo, for both applies you either guessed right and he's not comboing you for 200+ damage(and yes, with the latest improvements WT can reach 200) or you guessed wrong and you're going to eat the damage. I'll add (for good measure) that getting your SV blocked isn't necessarily the end of things and the difference of getting a CH or a normal hit in that situation is next to 0(you're eating a lot of damage either way). Why not rush him down? Well, you can try and you will die, CH VV blocks the air attacks, GV reaches far enough to prevent any ground attacks and CH 5H will zone you succesfully. All these options go to over 200 damage on you, and yes, VV and GV are unsafe, that does not put them out of business; do not give Sol a reason to use them, its a mixup where the rewards for you are too low. If you want to play aggressive (or not give up any ground unnecessarily) you can keep the distance short by running in and FD breaking accordingly to what you expect, jump FD is good too. To attack him successfully you'll have to keep in mind that his set of normals are dedicated to either attacking ground or attacking air, he cannot do both properly at the same time. Usually you can do a j.P whiff without him hitting you out of it(so actually you're going to do j.PP and have a single whiff or confirm a double into aircombo, but that's a minor detail). The reason for you to jump is because you would be expecting a ground attack, if you were wrong, this would be a good time to press the faultless guard buttons(or eat a lot of pain). If you were right, you got a wee bit of time to figure out what he whiffed, if it was 2D, 5H, 2S or 5S(f) you can attack with j.H and you will hit, if he did 5S(s), 2K, 2P or 5P you need to use j.S-P to hit, against the punches even that could be to late and you'd have to FD instead, if you don't FD you'll probably eat a VV that takes half your life away. If you expect him to be attacking air, which means 5K, 2H or VV in some extreme cases, you can usually sweep, which tends to CH. VV is a different case of course, just guard it if you see it coming. If you didn't see it coming he usually can't convert it anyways, unless he has 50% tension. If you want ground to ground, you need to be in 2S range, 2S is the only thing really that works properly and is hard to VV. 5S(f) is pretty much a no go since Sol's 5H beats it clean, 5S©, 5K, 2K and 5P are too hard to hit, 5H is just asking for trouble in ways you don't want to imagine. The only other normal that takes priority over 2S is 2P when you're in range to do it, because its whiff recovery and block recovery are far lower than 2S's. So if he backdashes, you aren't fucked as badly as with 2S and you might even keep your offense. Okizeme: When you are knocked down, there's several attacks from Sol that you will have to guard. If he jumps he will try to air attack you in such a way that he'll guard any of your reversals, oldest trick in the book and Sol can apply it really well, so you'll have to guard all air attacks from Sol. The other attacks are his punches, they recover in less than 12 frames and that means when they would hit meaty SV will not hit them. When you get oki against him, you're kinda in a situation where he doesn't have to do anything really quickly. You can't read a VV coming from him because he's taking a nap for a few frames and because it hits in 5 frames 2P and 5P won't recovery in time to guard it. What you do have that does counter VV is jump attacks like he does on you, you can setup fuzzy guard, but its generally useless because any smart player impact guards on their wakeup(keep it in mind for when your opponent tries it on you). The other thing you got is meaty GB. Keep in mind that Sol players have every reason to buffer a VV after guarding a GB so running in isn't the smartest thing to do there(though sometimes can bring home good rewards).

Someone should put this in the Johnny forums XD Especially about the part how you're jump canceling an airborne dash into a jump and thus cannot get ground moves:P

Isa betrayed all the Sol players and started playing Eddie XD Any current Sol is pretty ok to watch. A few notables are 012, Roi, Kishitaka, P.C and kusoru. Staple wild throw setup is WT dash in 2H and then either j.S/j.D CLSW or CLSW directly, this works on any character. Oh and I forgot to mention, generally if you jump in any direction except for neutral the screen moves to, so chances are that your forward jump causes you to miss your followup because you get a later and far higher wallbounce.

You're kinda looking to hit the sidewinder at chest/neck height. Everytime you get a clean hit, the clean hit boxsize is reduced and you need to set yourself up better and closer for the next hits. From what I noticed is that damage from attacks that keep the sidewinderloop going is neglectable, so it doesn't matter whether you do 2H CLSW, 2H j.S CLSW, j.S CLSW or CLSW on its own, generally you can get the same amount of reps and you'll do about the same damage. For afaik the biggest difference is 20 damage or so between most damaging and least damaging chain versions. For example, what I generally use is setup into first CLSW hit and then I attempt to use only 2H j.CLSW and get clean hits that way. The moment you forward jump, you generally have to end the combo by doing backward jump S CLSW land BR, otherwise your opponent will probably tech somewhere where you don't want it.