Renz Posted July 5, 2009 Posted July 5, 2009 Since Noel seems to be so popular online nowadays, I need a few tips on debunking her drive specifically since getting close to her is often tedious. Any tips and combos are welcomed.
ShakunohaChaos Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 you should ask this question in the Tao match-up thread it would make more sense if you did
Hi-C Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Swipe with 2A. Either that or work with your long reach attacks such as 6C and 5C. At least its worked so far for me. She has invul on the starting frames of the drives and closes in damn fast so watch out. If she does close the distance, use your barrier. She'll push herself out and will have to use the gunblast drive, or she'll be in the middle of one of her attacks and you'll have some precious time to run away/backdash/get a hit in to stop her. Combo-wise, I'm a dead fish. I look to poke Noels and screw over the drive. Sorry I can't help much.
Renz Posted July 6, 2009 Author Posted July 6, 2009 Swipe with 2A. Either that or work with your long reach attacks such as 6C and 5C. At least its worked so far for me. She has invul on the starting frames of the drives and closes in damn fast so watch out. If she does close the distance, use your barrier. She'll push herself out and will have to use the gunblast drive, or she'll be in the middle of one of her attacks and you'll have some precious time to run away/backdash/get a hit in to stop her. Combo-wise, I'm a dead fish. I look to poke Noels and screw over the drive. Sorry I can't help much. That's good help right there, no need to apologize Yeah, most of my losses have been pretty much from noels @_@. Even if I predicted what they would do, their drives would always manage to screw things up hehe. you should ask this question in the Tao match-up thread it would make more sense if you did On some of the other character boards there are topics similar to this. On top of that it helps other players with similar issues such as mine to find and address them.
Hi-C Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Noel drives are good. That's why their abused. You can kinda predict when the drive will come, its a matter of blocking correctly or getting away and set the matches pace. When a Noel uses her drive, its kind of saying "This is the pace I want to play at and have you scared." If you get intimidated (for good reason) then its game. She's good all-around generally, so i wouldn't blame you if you have a hard time. I know I do.
ShakunohaChaos Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Well if you want to beat a noel player you have to out space/ camp her. She has a tough time fighting against any character who can out space/camp her. Yeah she has her lil optic barrel move which is easy to avoid. When i fight a Noel player i use my drive a lot to poke at her and run away. I play hit and run versus Noel. 4d j.4d d and j.d will help you a lot in this fight. After hitting them with a bunch of drives attacks and heavy swearing the Noel will then try to rush you down. This is where things get kinda tricky. Now your like yay Noel is in close to me its going to be like Christmas WRONG!!! If you are playing people who are not that good you will get drive spammed and you more than likely will lose your temper, but dont fear theres a way to get around that. Now Noel is hella unsafe cuz after she does her drives she has to reload her gun, so this is where you 2a, 5a, 5b, d, or if your close grab, but remember there are attacks where you dont want to poke out of which is Spring raid if im right, well the gun spins around and pulls you in closer to her. Do not try to punish off of this attack because you will be eating bullets because that move is hella safe. Now when playing players without a lot of exp you will see see 2d a great deal which is a overhaed and all buttons as in (a,b,c,d) lead into some unsfae move where there are relaod frames so punish after that. I think i hit most of the problems
viewtiful Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Swipe with 2A. Every Noel I've played does the overhead if she see me going low.
Hi-C Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Every Noel I've played does the overhead if she see me going low. Are you spamming 5A? If your getting predictable, she will punish you. If your not, they may be a good player who on reaction is punishing you. Also at that, my friend usually mashes out his drive attacks (but knows which buttons he's pressing in order), so it could be coincidence that your just getting hit when your trying to hit them and they mess you over. Which Noel overhead are you referring to anyways? The flip kick drive?
seungpyohong Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 do super between her drives or back dash 5c ch or 5B counter hit i dont think 5a is a good idea. also if u focus defense she will get out of reach by time. anyways, by time u will be able to see some holes and punish
DLM16A2 Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 I have trouble fighting Noel with Tao. Ive been using Tager to counter Noels when i see her as their Main.
Rozy Posted July 7, 2009 Posted July 7, 2009 I also have been having trouble fighting Noel with Tao. I believe it's because of Noel's drive attack that lets her execute combo's continuously, but I could be wrong. And since Tao's jump box is so small, I find it difficult to maneuver around Noel at some points.
Renz Posted July 8, 2009 Author Posted July 8, 2009 So I've been fighting a lot of Noels lately and pretty much winning. The secret here is keeping her WHERE you want her. With that said, I will requote the previous comments: 6cing her whenever you're from afar. Take in mind MOST noels will try to get at you by jumping, and hate me for saying this, but Noel's zoning really does suck. You have plenty of time to keep her at a distance and get 4+ damage combos, usually gauranteeing you the game. You're up close, if she has you in a drive chain, perfect guard and GET OUT OF THERE. Unless you're God and you know exactly what to do, it's a good idea to escape. (Credit to Hi-C; this was a life saver.) Let's say you're up close and you beat her to the dominant position. 2b will go under her spinning jumping drive (Not the j.d) and give you the advantage while she's still recovering, if that's not a free combo I dunno what is. Just remember to try and lay off the C mashing with noel whenever you're up close. Usually not a good idea.
Rozy Posted July 8, 2009 Posted July 8, 2009 Thanks for the help. I haven't played online yet, just my bro who plays Noel so yeah. But I'll keep this all in mind the next time he wants a fight or when I'm doing story mode.
MumMum Posted July 10, 2009 Posted July 10, 2009 Sorry for off topic but - needs to be move to match-up thread.
Addfwyn Posted July 13, 2009 Posted July 13, 2009 My problem with noels is their drive chains, I can usually barrier it and high-low block the whole thing, but that drains almost my entire barrier. I just don't have the timing to perfect guard anything, it's a huge risk if I miss it. Usually if I can get the flow of the battle going early, I'm fine, but when they start pressuring me with drive chains, it just blows away my barrier and guard too fast. Are there frames in her chain that it's safe to try to back out of? Even a 4D~C or something?
naikou Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 Usually if I can get the flow of the battle going early, I'm fine, but when they start pressuring me with drive chains, it just blows away my barrier and guard too fast. Are there frames in her chain that it's safe to try to back out of? Even a 4D~C or something?Backdashing seems like a bad idea, since she has that "Blue Divide" move she can nail you with. I think it would be better to learn which of her drives are safe to sneak a 2a between.
canned.air Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 My problem with noels is their drive chains, I can usually barrier it and high-low block the whole thing, but that drains almost my entire barrier. I just don't have the timing to perfect guard anything, it's a huge risk if I miss it. even though noel's chains seem like and endless, unstoppable combo, there's actually a lot of holes in it. though it takes practice, when you're blocking and they're moving on to the next move in their drive, there's openings for you to do a 5B. You can't do it in between any of the drive moves, but experiment and you'll find the ones that you can. When you land that 5B, you can do a 3C, to a drive loop if you get all 3 hits. If you don't think you'll get all 3 hits in the 3c, you can do a forward drive with a B cancel after the 2nd of 3 hits to land on the other side for a mixup, do another 5B, 3c (3 hits) to a drive loop and be a happy camper again. in the other case when noel is doing the low drive moves 'cause you're blocking low a lot, you can do a 6B and that's the little flippy kick thing to go over the low drive move, do a 2A to a 3C and drive loop that way instead. if you're REALLY good with your timing, you can do a 4b+c to do a back throw, 236C and drive loop. i don't recommend this 'cause you have to be really close to noel and if you're blocking a lot you might not get that close.
GreyFlcn Posted July 18, 2009 Posted July 18, 2009 Noel's drives make her semi-invincible for a while. So, the first priority is landing your first attack. Both to stun her out of driving, but also to start your own combo. What I've found is that the most effective for me is to stay back, wait for an opening. Then lunge in with either an airdash or Distortion+B into short range. Spam some simple 2A/A/6A attacks until you crack her defences. Cat Spirit 1 (repeat for however long you want) Then Drive Loop. And then run away, and do it all over again And mix in a few pestering weak "drive by" horizontal drive attacks to keep em guessing when the real attack will come. It's all about Guerilla warfare, Neko style (Incidentally, when I first tried this out, I got a nasty email from the Noel user, calling me a spammer. I Lol'ed)
Villainous Posted July 18, 2009 Posted July 18, 2009 I had a lot of luck instant blocking and just super jumping backwards out and air dashing away. If you've got 50% the claw super seems to work pretty well too in the mix up situations where she can either go high or low. I wouldn't spam that. Barrier-ing the overhead pushes her waaaaay out too. But yeah I mostly just stay far away and use j.C to make contact with her. 6C is good too when you think she'll approach, especially since you can charge it and let it rip whenever she's in range. She seemed really hard for me at first but it seems like it's all just recognizing her stuff and escaping. Tao's range game seems to be better than hers, so use that to your advantage and once you get in RTSD. Once you lose advantage on the rush, just runaway again.
x Eternal Echo Posted July 23, 2009 Posted July 23, 2009 Anybody have any advice on mixing her up? If I d~b they sweep, which conveniently hits behind her also. If I d~c to try and bait out a jump for an airgrab she uses 6c which can lead into her loop and big damage. And her Drive overhead seems unpunishable, If I barrier guard she just rushes back end to start another blockstring till she gets a guard break. Noel is by far my worst match-up, I've lost atleast half of my matches to her.
Desov2 Posted July 24, 2009 Posted July 24, 2009 If noel is just mashing her way through her chain revolver then the odds are there are going to holes in the combo. Use those to strike for a CH with 5b for massive damage. Also, there are not many ways for her to start up her drive. The only low hit she has for Chain revolver is 6D, which is utterly terrible to start off with due to the start up frames being around 30 frames. So odds are, unless they are just mashing, they will start off with 2D or 5D. If it is 2D, (overhead arc gun sweep attack) just block and 5B her to the grave. I also wouldn't really barrier her drive unless you are about to break since it just makes her go flying losing a CH for you.
Gabriev Posted July 25, 2009 Posted July 25, 2009 What's the best neutral throw combo to use against Noel? The combo I learned was: throw > ad > j.c > drive loops blah blah blah The first drive loop after j.c won't connect against Noel. What throw combo should I be using?
Pirateyoshi Posted July 30, 2009 Posted July 30, 2009 What's the best neutral throw combo to use against Noel? The combo I learned was: throw > ad > j.c > drive loops blah blah blah The first drive loop after j.c won't connect against Noel. What throw combo should I be using? Noel, much like Carl, has an annoying air hitbox. I try to keep things really simple with Neutral Throw combos. B+C -> slight delay a.d jC -> 236B -> 2D~B -> 5B -> 2D~6 -> jC -> 8D~6 -> jC -> 236BBBB for around 2.5k Or even easier... B+C -> a.d jB -> jC -> 8D~6 -> 236BBBB for 2055.
GreyFlcn Posted August 1, 2009 Posted August 1, 2009 This is gonna sound amazingly stupid. But I found a way to deal with Noel spam. Assuming you do inevitably get caught up in teh spam Rather than comboing your way out of it. Try this: Jump Backwards Lets you avoid the usual upper/lower attack which Noels use to continue the drive spam. Giving you a little breathing room to launch your own counter offensive.
ShinobiBrown Posted August 6, 2009 Posted August 6, 2009 ... Is this thread really just on countering Noel's Drive? That isn't the main source to her offense and the least you need to worry about considering drive spam can be handled by a simple throw. I came here to read what Tao has for an answer to Noel's pressure game ie her 5A x n > dash 5A x n or her 6C > 2C > 66C > 2C. My friend swears up and down he can't beat Noel with Tao and would much rather fight Arakune or Nu . Tao's weak guard libra makes it pretty easy for Noel to guard crush her if she's keep pressure going and considering Noel's hitbox, some of Tao's combos become useless (unless the timing is just different). What are Tao's defensive options in terms of handling Noel's pressure game and mix-ups? EDIT: Barrier Block only does so much and if Tao bursts, forget about it.
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