[CSE] Ragna Gameplay Discussion

[Yggjrasil]

Guys check this vid out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NqaxFjn1HlA

Kaqn is the only one that I've seen to pull these long-ass combos, everyone else finishes their combos way too early lol.

Kaqn...

Overrated my ass.

Why does kaqn get astraled in almost every match he's in?

[ADS627]

Karma for filibusterer.

[Gramas]

America is free.

All about dat Europe :3

***

[KayEff]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijTGFpfhYPA - 1:25

dead spike is still burst safe

°ﾟ°｡｡ヾ( ~▽~)ﾂ

[BatousaiJ]

That match was painful to watch.

Nothing makes you feel more free than getting burst baited twice in a row.

You'd have to delay 2C/5C anyway a little after deadspike there so it makes sense to just block while you wait and if you happen to bait burst while doing it, all the more better.

[Nemesis]

That dinky Jp music they played at the end seems to exascerbate tsubaki's loss

[Akureikaze]

Theme of Spinoza's Death

Respect Version

ouch

[Tong]

Ok guys, I tested this exact same combo in CS2

"Requires at least 72 Heat before BK Activation

6B 5C 6C 214214D dash 5D(1) 214D 5C 5D(1) 214B 214D 6D (JC) j.214C 5D (DC) 6D j.623D~Heel Drop j.214B 214D 5D 214214D

Damage:6627 Heat Gain:11 (earned by 6B 5C 6C)"

from: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=UwubMIz5_dY#t=410s

This is odd, the combos ends with 45 Heat left (can't DbD), and yet in CSEX Ragna had the exact meter to perform it.

However, if I trade that "5C 5D(1) 214B..." for "6D j.D whiff 5D(1) 214B..." I can finish with 4 Heat left (DbD possible).

I guess Ragna's heat nerf isnt bad as it seems, or maybe some moves got a heat buff to compesate it. Full BK combos using 50 Heat may still be possible...

Notes:

From: 6D j.D 5C 6C 214D 5C 5D(1) BK dash 5B 5D(1) 214D 6D j.D whiff 5D(1) 214B 214D 6D...

V.1: (JC) j.214C 5D (DC) 6D J.623D~Heel Drop j.214B 214D 5D 214214D

V.2: j.623D~Heel Drop falling j.D J.214C 5D [214A 214D]x2 214214D

Both deal the same exact damage, though V.1 doesnt lose corner and requires more heat.

Both can be done with starting 50 meter.

Both variations can be done from most BK combos, but V.1 will require much more heat, whereas V.2 will make everthing "meterless";

Pretty neat imo.

Edited November 25, 2011 by Tong

[Beat_By-X]

Requieres 50 heat ONLY + Universal :

6B 5C 6C dash land 5D(1) 214D 5C 5D(1) 214214D B 5D(1) 214D 5D(1) 214B 214D 6D (JC) j.214C 5D (DC) land 5D(1) j.623D~Heel Drop j.214B 214D 5D 214214D

Damage: 6364

Edited November 25, 2011 by Beat_By-X

[LuminAbyss]

Good find Tong! Maybe they just made the 50 heat BK combos more specific on starters and what moves you use in the combo now, it was pretty silly how you could get 50 heat off every combo before (silly but kinda necessary)

[Tong]

Get up fools, let's find CSEX combos.

-Disable Emergency Roll and make stomp combos.

-Exclude the Blue Beat resulted from it ^

-For air combos, j.D (JC) j.D is always possible in CSEX. If the dummy techs between j.C/j.D and Belial Edge (in CS2), assume that j.D Belial Edge would be possible in CSEX. Same for Inferno divider and j.C/j.D (JC) stuff.

-Can't do nothing about 6D or 6C buff.

For example:

5B 6A 214B dash 5A 5B/5C 5D (DC) 5C/2C 6A (HJC) j.D (JC) j.D j.214C 5D 623D~Heel Drop

Bold = Only possible in CSEX.

Of course, that's if 6A GH Combos still work there.

Midscreen:

6B 5C 6C (DC) 6B 5D (DC) dash 5C 5D (DC) 6A (HJC) j.D (JC) j.D j.623D~Heel drop

Damage (before bold/teching):2834, 85% screen carry. Old standard combo involving midscreen DS dealt 3487.

6B 5C 6C (DC) 6B 2C 5C 5D (DC) dash 5C 6A (HJC) j.D (JC) j.D j.623D~Heel Drop

Damage:3086. May be more damaging in CSEX, since 5C and 2C got a damage buff. Possible replacer for the old midscreen DS combos.

I know it's pretty "bootleg~ish", but I can't wait that long to test new stuff lol

[MashThat5A]

Can't really test 6B combos due to P2 changes. Damage numbers are probably off due to 5B + 5C damage buff.

I'm importing Extend. I'll compile a list of combos when I get it.

[Tong]

Doesnt change the fact that 6B stuff is legit. And surely these don't have the exact damage but so what, it's close enough to check his overrall damage

6B's P2 nerf may be compensated by 5C/2C damage buff. On some combos, the 6B pickups allows roughly 300/500~ damage improvement over his previous version.

Btw, I've seen some videos, and 2D (RC) 6B hilariously works.

[MashThat5A]

I'm not talking about damage for 6B, I'm talking about tech time....

[Tong]

Won't affect that much those combos imo.

Even combo-late 6B in CSEX were possible in CS2.

Anyway, I would love to test j.D and 6D... I hope to see new 10k first-day combos from you MashBro

[Tari]

How much did 6B's P2 change?

[MashThat5A]

It changed from 92 to 89 iirc.

[-Seo]

P2 went from 92 to 89, and P1 went from 70 to 75.

[LuminAbyss]

That's a pretty fair trade to me. I always hated it's P1, and it's not like 89 has effected his much better damage output this time around.

[Tari]

Oh, a 3 point change. Hahaha.

Okay, that's a much smaller change than I was expecting.

[Spirit Juice]

Requieres 50 heat ONLY + Universal :

6B 5C 6C dash land 5D(1) 214D 5C 5D(1) 214214D B 5D(1) 214D 5D(1) 214B 214D 6D (JC) j.214C 5D (DC) land 5D(1) j.623D~Heel Drop j.214B 214D 5D 214214D

Damage: 6364

Tried to see if starters like TK GH and forward throw would work, but sadly the TK version does not work (they can tech out before the second hit of the last 5D connects). I don't remember if throw works, but I think it's just short of getting enough meter to YnK. This is assuming you start at 50 heat, of course.

If anyone else has a good idea on how make this work off of those starters in CSEX, post up.

[Tong]

A full BK *should* work from a clean TK GH, its proration is excellent. Imo, the first part in red is making it impossible.

Forward throw has bad (P2 55) proration though, but it should be possible to finish with DbD, not for 50 Heat I think since the cooldown *might* affect the final Hell's Fang loop...

It's possible to simulate CSEX Throw in CS2 by RC'ing it, but I'm sure that Heat Gauge use penalty PLUS BK's would screw up Heat Gain values.

But hell, you can finish any BK combo off anything practically.

[Spirit Juice]

Well, assuming the best [universal] follow up you can do is 2A 5C 5D(1) after TK GH, the full combo does not work. Not sure why.

[MashThat5A]

Well, assuming the best [universal] follow up you can do is 2A 5C 5D(1) after TK GH, the full combo does not work. Not sure why.

Air Gauntlet Hades repeat proration

[Beat_By-X]

For Spirit Juice : TK corner 2A B D1 BK B D1 DS Land C D1 214B 214D Land 6D (jc8) Land BE D2 dash cancel Land ID2 214B 214D D2 (22C = 30 hits 4989 damage in CS2) / ( DbD = 98 hits 6089 damage in CS2) UNIVERSAL Same combo do more damage in CSEX. Same combo starter 2A C D1 BK = 5411 (22C) / 6492 (DbD)

Edited November 30, 2011 by Beat_By-X