InWithTheAshes Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 ... You don't think they couldn't just, well, make a completely differing playstyle for him?
zeth07 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 You don't like an alternate form of Ragna but would rather have an extra Taokaka ? She's at least an entirely different person. Her own personality, her own look (still similar to Tao but whatever), and of course she'd play different but that applies to any character even if they are alternate versions. My point is that kind of Ragna would still be Ragna, except I imagine he would just make nonsensical noises and have no relevant "story" to the point of just being a "what if" character at which point you might as well just say it's Unlimited Ragna. Otherwise all people are asking for is "Another Ragna" with a different playstyle, which I feel is wasted when any other character would bring in a new playstyle. And yes I do find it a bit silly that they have all these other characters with alternate versions before some of the other characters I mentioned were even playable. Jin/Hakumen is an obvious exception, Noel/Mu is somewhat reasonable for the story, but Tsubaki/Izayoi and Hazama/Terumi came out of nowhere basically in terms of being playable or even relevant going INTO BBCP since there was no indication of that kind of stuff possibly happening going into the game.
Luminos564 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) ... You don't think they couldn't just, well, make a completely differing playstyle for him? Not really. BB is a game where each character has a specific gimmick (Drive) and Bloodedge was stated to have none of that since he lived in a time before any of that stuff was available. This isn't like Guilty Gear where Drive button is just another button to be pressed. It is integral. She's at least an entirely different person. Her own personality, her own look (still similar to Tao but whatever), and of course she'd play different but that applies to any character even if they are alternate versions. Well whatever floats your boat chief. I never said I didn't understand that there are people that want her playable after all. My point is that kind of Ragna would still be Ragna, except I imagine he would just make nonsensical noises and have no relevant "story" to the point of just being a "what if" character at which point you might as well just say it's Unlimited Ragna. Otherwise all people are asking for is "Another Ragna" with a different playstyle, which I feel is wasted when any other character would bring in a new playstyle. Except that none of the alternate form characters we got are "What ifs". They are all connected within the story. Even Izayoi, which was mentioned by Kokonoe to be a prototype Murakumo (albeit very briefly). For all we know, Ragna could develop an alternate form down the like like Mu-12 was. I wouldn't exactly call that a waste of a slot if he plays nothing like his original form. Besides, after the Naruto Storm 3 roster was revealed, I believe that is the now official guideline on how to waste character slots. Edited June 1, 2013 by Luminos564
zeth07 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Not really. BB is a game where each character has a specific gimmick (Drive) and Bloodedge was stated to have none of that since he lived in a time before any of that stuff was available. This isn't like Guilty Gear where Drive button is just another button to be pressed. It is integral. Why would his drive have to have anything to do with "story" stuff or ars magus or whatever? That seems totally irrelevant to them making a character's playstyle..... EDIT: Plenty of characters don't have Nox Nyctores if that's what you're referring to.
Luminos564 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Why would his drive have to have anything to do with "story" stuff or ars magus or whatever? That seems totally irrelevant to them making a character's playstyle..... EDIT: Plenty of characters don't have Nox Nyctores if that's what you're referring to. Because his Drive is directly derived from his Azure Grimmoire. It sucks out people's souls and heals him, just like in actual gameplay. It is the same with Jin. His Drive is dependent on Yukianesa. Without it, he can't actually freeze people, much like how Bloodedge couldn't do any of his Drives in Phase Shift due to the loss of function in his Azure.
ElegantShadow Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) Honestly, Ragna having an alternate form is completely, one-hundred percent inevitable. The reason why, you ask? Ahem... Order Sol, anyone? In regards to how this alternate form would play... I haven't a clue. However, considering there are currently 3 or 4 character with alternate forms (I say "3 or 4" because Hakumen being Jin's alternate form may be a matter of opinion.) and the fact that they all play differently, I do think it's safe to assume that if/when Ragna gets one, it will play differently from him. "Azure Guardian Ragna"?... I want now! Edited June 1, 2013 by ElegantShadow
zeth07 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Because his Drive is directly derived from his Azure Grimmoire. It sucks out people's souls and heals him, just like in actual gameplay. It is the same with Jin. His Drive is dependent on Yukianesa. Without it, he can't actually freeze people, much like how Bloodedge couldn't do any of his Drives in Phase Shift due to the loss of function in his Azure. You're missing the point but whatever.
Narroo Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Because his Drive is directly derived from his Azure Grimmoire. It sucks out people's souls and heals him, just like in actual gameplay. It is the same with Jin. His Drive is dependent on Yukianesa. Without it, he can't actually freeze people, much like how Bloodedge couldn't do any of his Drives in Phase Shift due to the loss of function in his Azure. So? He could have a different Drive.
Luminos564 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 So? He could have a different Drive. Which would be what exactly? I'm not even trying to sound smug, I legitimately would like to hear what people think Bloodedge himself could use as a Drive (assuming he's the alternate form of Ragna that gets made). You're missing the point but whatever. And the point I missed is? English isn't my first language so if I misunderstood something, please inform me of such.
YukiBlue Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Why let creative juices flow when you can give the entire cast an alternate form?
Moy_X7 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 (edited) And the point I missed is? English isn't my first language so if I misunderstood something, please inform me of such. This might not be his point but not all Drives are connected to things like "the Azure", "seether", and "Ars" (story-related things). Makoto's Drive doesn't seem to have anything to do with any of the above. Rachel's wind is most likely her own, innate power. The same goes for Valkenhayn and I could go on and on about this. In short, Bloodedge could have a Drive of his own without it being related to any of that magical, mumbo-jumbo crap. Not too say I wouldn't want a Black Beast Ragna but I would much prefer to have completely unique characters such as Saya or Nine first. Edited June 1, 2013 by Moy_X7
Luminos564 Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Why let creative juices flow when you can give the entire cast an alternate form? Weren't Guilty Gear's EX characters basically that though? This might not be his point but not all Drives are connected to things like "the Azure", "seether", and "Ars" (story-related things). Makoto's Drive doesn't seem to have anything to do with any of the above. Rachel's wind is most likely her own, innate power. The same goes for Valkenhayn and I could go on and on about this. I know, but I wasn't talking about anyone else other than Ragna-Bloodedge (and Jin as an example). Yes, not every character's story related powers translate into their Drive, but Ragna's however do. In fact, they're entirely dependent on the Azure he's using as a substitute arm. In short, Bloodedge could have a Drive of his own without it being related to any of that magical, mumbo-jumbo crap. Oh I am open to the idea for certain. I'm just having a hard time imagining how a handi-capable, Azure-less Ragna could fight and not have it end up like I described earlier. Not too say I wouldn't want a Black Beast Ragna but I would much prefer to have completely unique characters such as Saya or Nine first. Perfectly valid. I'm just pointing out that, from my POV, Ragna having an alternate form is inevitable. What it'll be however, is up in the air though.
ElegantShadow Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 Which would be what exactly? I'm not even trying to sound smug, I legitimately would like to hear what people think Bloodedge himself could use as a Drive (assuming he's the alternate form of Ragna that gets made). Personally, I think his alternate form would have some sort of teleport, and perhaps better long-ranged options. The problem with coming up with any credible idea of what his alternate form would play like is that not enough is known about what Ragna is capable of outside of stealing life. The same goes for BloodEdge, we have NO idea of what he's capable of because there's a very small amount of information on him at this point in time. Why let creative juices flow when you can give the entire cast an alternate form? Thank you for the new Sig. ^^
Famhuss Posted June 1, 2013 Posted June 1, 2013 The way I see it Bloodedge could revolve more around using the scythe and the sword forms of his weapon. His drive could possibly be a way to switch between both forms, he could retain his old sword based moves and blood scythe if you wanted and have some scythe based moves added. That sounds pretty fun to me though.
Narroo Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 Weren't Guilty Gear's EX characters basically that though? I know, but I wasn't talking about anyone else other than Ragna-Bloodedge (and Jin as an example). Yes, not every character's story related powers translate into their Drive, but Ragna's however do. In fact, they're entirely dependent on the Azure he's using as a substitute arm. Oh I am open to the idea for certain. I'm just having a hard time imagining how a handi-capable, Azure-less Ragna could fight and not have it end up like I described earlier. Perfectly valid. I'm just pointing out that, from my POV, Ragna having an alternate form is inevitable. What it'll be however, is up in the air though. So, if he loses his Grimore, he's not allowed a drive at all? Why can't he adapt his style and use different moves? That would be the whole point of getting a new Ragna. He could completely imitate order Sol and use special cancels for his drives.
Agni Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 We don't need more goddamn "Alternate Form" characters. Sheesh, give us some new characters. I GUESS "Order Ragna" could be cool but I'd rather the time spent developing an alternate form would be better spent making a new character. Then again, we have 4 new characters with CP so I ain't complainin'
Luminos564 Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 We don't need more goddamn "Alternate Form" characters. Sheesh, give us some new characters. On the contrary, I believe ASW needs to go all Oprah on us and make even more Alternate Form characters . Joking, joking. Kindly put down the pitchforks and torches. Though it is true that we don't NEED any more Alternate Forms, we are going to get at least one more down the line. Maybe not in CP necessarily, but definitely somewhere down the line in the next game or two in the series. So, if he loses his Grimore, he's not allowed a drive at all? Why can't he adapt his style and use different moves? That would be the whole point of getting a new Ragna. He could completely imitate order Sol and use special cancels for his drives. If we're talking within the context of the Azure Grimmoire, then no he shouldn't if it's the same old Soul Eater drive. I never said that he wasn't allowed to have a Drive. In fact, I was saying that Bloodedge would need to have a Drive (since it is integral to the overall game mechanics). But I was having problems thinking up how he could fight if Bloodedge himself existed in a time before Ars Armagus (Drive) was developed and thus justifying Bloodedge being playable. Of course, I'm sure gameplay-and-story segregation will ultimately prevail because of timey-wimey-googly-wobbly-bits.
Chaoschao222 Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 Ars Armagus (Drive) Don't make it sound like the two are related. You could easily just make a stance change and call it a Drive. Make him like Gen and have D shift Blood Scythe from sword to scythe an' bam, Drive accomplished. They could give Bloodedge anything unique and it'd qualify as a Drive, even a semi-automatic shotgun that ran on rainbows and cupcake essence.
Litherain-XIII Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 why not just make his drive called some sword art where he throws his sword like some boomerang or different long ranged attacks like stinger from DMC but for bloodedge. make him have a number count or drive bar ontop his heat bar that's max out to 5. make him have 236D and 214D and 623D inputs to use more powerful versions of those attacks that take up a bar and have a charge function with those inputs holding D which will just take up more drive counts that make it unblockable or different properties based on how long you charge it. idk just throw some shit in there and call it a day. _-_
harmless kitten Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 Drive =/= ars magus. Valkenhayn is a werewolf and existed long before the creation of ars magus. It just so happens most of the cast relies on an Armagus or other special power. However, Phase 0 Ragna is kind of sucky. I'm pretty sure the "scythe" of Blood-scythe is just the energy/seithr of the Azure Grimoire much like his other attacks. Of course if they really wanted to it really wouldn't be hard to make something up for him.
Luminos564 Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 (edited) Don't make it sound like the two are related. Drive =/= ars magus. Valkenhayn is a werewolf and existed long before the creation of ars magus. It just so happens most of the cast relies on an Armagus or other special power. I always thought they were one and the same. You learn something new every day. They could give Bloodedge anything unique and it'd qualify as a Drive, even a semi-automatic shotgun that ran on rainbows and cupcake essence. Now that's something I'd personally like to see made XD. Edited June 2, 2013 by Luminos564
Volt Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 They could give Bloodedge anything unique and it'd qualify as a Drive, even a semi-automatic shotgun that ran on rainbows and cupcake essence. I hope you don't mind if sig this. Anyway, Bloodedge is Ragna without seithr around him, nothing about time travel, he only couldn't get seithr into his grimoire because there weren't any around in the phase shift time and the few that were was nullified by Celica. And I just noticed Tao called one of her DD's after one of Jubei's techniques (Cat Person's secret art: Hexaedge.) So if he actually gets playable, do you think he'll have it?
Luminos564 Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 And I just noticed Tao called one of her DD's after one of Jubei's techniques (Cat Person's secret art: Hexaedge.) So if he actually gets playable, do you think he'll have it? Possibly, though I am just not seeing why people want Jubei to be playable so much. I'm not dissing the character or anything, but I've always found him more suitable as this powerful NPC than a playable character.
Agni Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 even a semi-automatic shotgun that ran on rainbows and cupcake essence. This NEEDS to become a new weapon for Platinum's drive in the fourth BB game.
ElegantShadow Posted June 2, 2013 Posted June 2, 2013 Why not give her a gun-blade while they're at it?
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