Chaos Code

[ShinHezekiah]

I got an update as well. I haven't tried breaking Training Mode (getting no hits on the combo counter) just yet, but we'll see.

[Fujiwara]

No. I managed to CH a blocking practice dummy again today.

[Star-Demon]

I got to play this for the first time today.

I picked Hermes - triangle color rules. She seems very oki and setup based, with a lot of emphasis on spacing instead of attempting to open up opponents.

I had a hard time since I didn't realize her kicks were more go-to than 5a. None of us on location really checked command list or anything - it was all exploration and good old FIGURE IT OUT and DO BETTER . about 6 or 7 people were in line.

To be honest picking up a game like this usully comes with this situation:

Person who brought it knows a decent amount, has decent Fundamentals.

I can contend but I have no clue about what buttons do what. What characters do what and if those whats are high low or what.

I also don't really know about the counter/Tech (same resource?) and all sorts of other buttons.

Other players I beat regularly often mash or pick much more easier characters with followups instead of combos...

It makes me feel really stupid, but I picked hermes and nothing really stood out until later. It seems they got a lot more damage from blah blah followup followup Super for about 25 to 30% and I'm mostly guessing their wakeup and punishing with whip, projectile or attempting to pressure them and opening them up. Still, though, It's not damage. I also had a lot of trouble crossing people up with j.lk or j.hk

It's clear I'm making solid reads but I'm not getting damage and experimenting on what I can or can't get away with, but I still lose a lot despite having better fundamentals...maybe I don't have them?

Anyways, the game is not bad, although there were times where I played against cerberus and was like "wow hitboxes"

Edited February 8, 2013 by Star-Demon

[ShinHezekiah]

Easy damage isn't exactly one of Hermes' strong suits, especially at mid-screen. I really hope you picked the 214A/C extra special, otherwise you'll never be doing any damage.

I also wouldn't recommend trying to do cross-ups with her. Her air normals aren't really made for it, unless you try doing some air-dash nonsense, which you'll probably just get hit out of. This, of course, coming from my equally (or perhaps more) limited experience with the game.

[Star-Demon]

I usually pick the second and fourth specials. TBH no clue how it all come together or how to actually use her traps and orbs.

[ShinHezekiah]

Second and fourth? That means you're picking the right ones. Lol.

The fiery dash special (214C) is air unblockable and is probably the most damaging special that Hermes has. It's pretty easy to combo into and your best source of meterless damage.

Her ice trap (pentagram) super (214214K) is good for setting up an unblockable situation (6+CD for guard crush, costs meter) and can result in some pretty dumb trades in your favor if someone hits you with a jump-in. Depending on what you trade with, you can usually combo the opponent after fairly easily.

I'm making it sound like I'm the resident Hermes expert here, which really isn't the case...

[DubiousCurvLoop]

That's all correct. I didn't even know 214c was air unblockable. I've been playing this game for weeks now, and I'm still learning stuff.

Orbs aren't really used for oki like one would expect, mainly because of how they function. Hermes can't control when they explode; they explode by themselves after sitting on screen for a certain amount of time. That can disrupt the opponents' offense or force them to stop what they're doing if they happen to be beside one that's about to go off. She can detonate them with her lighting bolt (623b/d) which also creates a smaller bolt wherever there's an orb, Hermes has too much recovery for that to have oki utility. Imo, that's better used for zoning. Also, the fact that she lacks a practical crossup hurts her oki potential further.

Her other moves also help her zoning ability. You already know about the whips - 236c for air coverage and 236a for ground. 214a can also be used to control ground space, but it should definitely be used at the end of your ground combos if you want maximum damage. Same with her 214c, which you can kind of just throw out there to fish for counterhits. Her 22b ice pit is great to protect the space in front of her. It doesn't go away when Hermes is hit, so it keeps people from jumping in on her if she's behind it. That gives her time to put some orbs on the screen. The 22d is a full-screen-traveling low. You can have a 22b on the ground and do 22d to control almost all of the ground. If 22d hits, you can easily confirm into 236236a/c on reaction to the hit from fullscreen.

That's not say Hermes doesn't have any rushdown tricks. I think her best oki tool is the 22b ice pit. She can do a simple combo into 2d and drop a meaty 22b under opponents to force them to block on wakeup, which she can combo off of on hit and continue pressure after on block. Hermes has arguable the best regular throw in the game, because she gets a free combo off of it anywhere on screen. She jump in with an air normal, cancel into air 214b, and drop down with falling normal for a double overhead. Hermes gets her biggest damage in the corner, with meterless guaranteed stun combos and infinites. There's the unblockable trick that ShinHezekiah mentioned, which Hermes can combo after.

[ShinHezekiah]

I'm still trying to get the hang of her whole corner loop (infinite, I suppose) shenanigans with the 2B, dash up cl.D 214B. The input buffer helps a lot, but it's still pretty rough to pull off, especially if you're trying to keep it going at least 3 reps until you're just out of range and have to use 5B and set off the orbs.

Do you have any idea why anyone would bother picking Step with her? I've seen a few Japanese players do it, but I never really understood why. I mean, she can't do her loop without Run, and no one uses her command throw.

[Star-Demon]

**useful stuff*

Oh cool - thanks. I still didn't even know the inputs - we sometimes put a "NO LOOKING" rule up when we try a new game.

So - what was orb input?

I...Infinites?

Instant kusoge! :P

[Pichy]

You've clearly never watched a decent Ruri match mate.

[Star-Demon]

What are the benefits of step?

[FerrellJ]

What are the benefits of step?

You can dash cancel your normals on hit or block. There may be more I'm unaware of but that's the main reason for it.

[ShinHezekiah]

You can dash cancel your normals on hit or block. There may be more I'm unaware of but that's the main reason for it.

That seems to be the main reason, but I think some characters just have bad Run dashes. Pretty much every Celia player I've seen picks Step instead of Run, although she can't seem to dash cancel. Or at least, I can't get it to work at all. She can cancel her dash at any time with an attack though. Weird...

EDIT: Oh, and Star-Demon. The orb input is 214B to place one, 214D to fire a small blast which also travels to placed orbs (kinda, sorta like Mu's steins) and 214BD for the awesome EX blast.

Edited February 8, 2013 by ShinHezekiah

[Star-Demon]

There's EX moves? =O

[Hecatom]

Yes there are, but only a few selected moves have ex versions

The movelist of each character shows what moves have an Ex version

[Star-Demon]

Yes there are, but only a few selected moves have ex versions

The movelist of each character shows what moves have an Ex version

Ah, well looking at movelist was forbidden. Would have been nice, though.

[Fujiwara]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnp7W9H_WLw

Kudlak mirrors, yo.

Between me and my brother. I'm on the 1P side.

I plan on going back into the lab with this guy... His damage is meh.

I only spent a few hours of yesterday messing with him. Depending on whether I feel like getting good with him, I'll probably fill out the wiki.

[SansProtocol]

That reminds me, I have to do a writeup or vid on some basic combos and oki setups with him. The man gets air tech oki as well. He's pretty good.

[Fujiwara]

You have combos do share.

[Hecatom]

I just turn on my ps3 and noticed that it downloaded a patch for Chaos Code.

What is new?

[Delrian]

Trophy stuff IIRC.

[Tenryo]

The patch is just to change trophy descriptions. Nothing serious in the grand scheme of gameplay.

I have been keeping in touch with FKD for quite some time about many things. For starters I suggested revealing all character's individual health and stun rankings, and other things related to overall damage. I was told that a Chaos Code hardcover guide is in the works which answers all questions pertaining to that subject and more, and will see a release shortly after the International versions of the game.

My main question was about certain features that aren't in the game that are in older games (visible damage and input option in training mode, dummy record & playback, etc.) I was told that shortly in the future there will be an actual damage and input option in training mode, and getting the proper training mode mechanics and fixing the game's bugs is top priority alongside proper netcode. Their response towards lack of other features including netcode was understandable; they had to meet the only deadline that they created for themselves (Winter 2012) and trying to implement proper netcode to please everyone is no easy task. FKD asks for patience as their secrecy gives them the chance to have time to actually go through various QA tests and change things before they release it to the public.

Edited February 10, 2013 by Tenryo

[ShinHezekiah]

I spent some time figuring out the stun rankings, but I couldn't quite figure out exactly how the health works in the game. There seem to be individual guts rankings or other types of scaling in place, but I really have no idea how they work.

Stun Rating: (from highest to lowest)

Bravo

Cerberus, Celia I, Hikaru, MG Hikaru, Rui

Kudlak-Sin, Vein, Catherine, Hermes

Kagari

Cthylla

Cait & Sith, Celia II

For health rankings I used Hermes' 5A and tried to see how many hits it took and broke it down like this.

Bravo 54

Cerberus 52

Rui, Vein, Hikaru, MG Hikaru 49

Catherine 47

Hermes 46

Kagari 45

Celia I, II 44

Cait & Sith, Cthylla, Kudlak-Sin 43

I repeated this process and used her 5C instead (which is really shitty in terms of damage, by the way) which gave me different results for characters who seemed to have the same amount of "health" when hit by 5A.

It was only later that I realized this whole process was flawed because I allowed characters to be dizzied before I continued hitting them. I did NOT hit them during the dizzy, but shortly thereafter because I thought that would not make a difference. From what I've seen, it apparently DOES make a difference, even if you damage a character after the dizzy period has expired. It seems to do more damage than usual, rather than less, as one might expect.

I know, this is mostly speculation and whatnot, but I'm glad to hear that they have plans to release a book with tasty information. I assume frame data is one of the "and more" things to be included as well.

[Ragnorok64]

Rui is nearer the top on both charts. I knew that girl had all the good thickness in all the right places.

[aldazo]

The patch is just to change trophy descriptions. Nothing serious in the grand scheme of gameplay.

I have been keeping in touch with FKD for quite some time about many things. ...fixing the game's bugs is top priority alongside proper netcode. Their response towards lack of other features including netcode was understandable; they had to meet the only deadline that they created for themselves (Winter 2012) and trying to implement proper netcode to please everyone is no easy task...

Please tell them to use GGPO for the netcode, it is very reliable and I think is free. (Skullgirls use it).