[CT+CS1] Noel Match Videos & Discussion

[kadiev]

Ill most likely load a lot more. Also ill be hosting game rooms some night and record.

[Aginor]

Here's a vid of me playing. Too lazy to record vids of myself even though I have a capture card. :|

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j71uHLykHYM (Me vs. CopperDabbit)

[FunkyP]

^^^ Incredibly tough matchup against a very skilled player. Very good effort in that video.

[Runis]

Aginor, one thing I noticed was in the final round of the first match, you could have RC'd the Bloom trigger and dashed in for a 6C 2367C. If it's going to win you the round, it's worth it. (if you have 100 heat, you can RC and dash in for a 236236D) One thing people always tell me when I got competitive is "Don't be flashy, don't be greedy - Just take the fucking win."

[WayINside]

Aginor: nice vids, but i get the feeling that you and the arakuna guys burst a little to early in the match. while as facing aracuna you have excuse for doing so cause being cursed is a real pain. he as facing noel should keep his burst till the very last moment, he really don't need any 5000-6000 combo from BNB...

[kadiev]

Pod 4 Round 1 Videos(Playlist 6 Videos)

http://www.youtube.com/user/kadiev#play/user/102DCBA18FDCC3E9

Pod 4 Round 2 Videos(Playlist 6 Videos)

http://www.youtube.com/user/kadiev#play/user/10BCCFC06E4C73F1

This is my noel from the tournament and others that I have watched. I would always like to improve so anything you have to say post here or youtube.

[archling]

Don't drop 6C anti air hits. Every 6C hit you make on an airborne enemy should lead to a combo. Also, you're eating Rachel's hits far too cheaply. Calm down. Take your time. No need to dash into pumpkin or jump into lightning rods. There's really not much else other than tightening up your game.

[confusedxphreak]

I know I'm probably not the best person to give advice, but anything helps, right? :P Anyway, I see you 2D->28D a lot. Try not to end her chain revolver with 28D after a blocked 2D because a blocked or whiffed 28D equals easy punishment from your opponents. The habit of chaining certain revolver drive techniques are hard to break, but try to 236D after a blocked 2D to give yourself space and an occasional 214D to throw your opponents off more often. Besides what I stated above, tightening up your 66C BC loop, and what archling stated, I think you're a great Noel player. Well, better than me anyway. Haha.

[kadiev]

Thanks guys, I realize now how over aggressive I was trying to mix defensive with mine but kinda hard. I love 2D so good. I started to drive spam alot more of it later I think because I was just sleepy.

[Rubbishnoise]

I love 2D so good.

And I'm depressed the 2D in BB:CS is no longer an overhead... at least at the location test, currently...

[Mysrt]

if they nerf 2D like that i feel like they would have to give us some sort of new overhead. They nerfed noel so much from what has been posted. I don't see how they could seriously give us only 1 overhead move, when that overhead move is one of the slowest overheads in the game. I know we also have the jump D overhead but i feel like that one doesn't even count.

[dragontamer]

j.D isn't an overhead, so I doubt that the new j.Dish move is an overhead either.

[saberseven]

poor Noel she's got it bad in CS

[Mysrt]

j.D isn't an overhead, so I doubt that the new j.Dish move is an overhead either.

its a very late jump d, they go over in the training vid. It's so hard to pull off thats why i don't even bother with it

[saberseven]

that's not J.D it's the 6B drive, he just did the jump drive cancel

[Johnny]

Hi all, new European Noel player here.

I've been playing for a few months now, but lately it seems that I just can't improve my game anymore.

With this game being my first "Guilty Gear-style" game combined with bad habits I can't seem to lose and constant "Wait, you can do that!?" moments, I just don't know how to start improving my game.

I've put some matches up on youtube. I'd really appreciate any advice you guys could give me.

http://www.youtube.com/user/JohnnyRH#play/user/714FA20C88ED001D

[archling]

Tell your friend that Jin's 5B 5C j.B j.C j.D ice car doesn't work on Noel because she's short. You have to do 5B 5C j.B j.C land 5B ice car instead. As for you, the first step is to work on not dropping combos and to make the most of your hits. You should be hit confirming your counter hits into 3C or 5D 6C. If you want to get better, the only way is to just play better people. You'll start losing your bad habits once you get punished for them every time.

[dragontamer]

Hi all, new European Noel player here.

I've been playing for a few months now, but lately it seems that I just can't improve my game anymore.

With this game being my first "Guilty Gear-style" game combined with bad habits I can't seem to lose and constant "Wait, you can do that!?" moments, I just don't know how to start improving my game.

I've put some matches up on youtube. I'd really appreciate any advice you guys could give me.

http://www.youtube.com/user/JohnnyRH#play/user/714FA20C88ED001D

Stagger that 5A. Just 5Aing them over and over at max speed doesn't really do anything, and the 5A -> Dash -> 5A is generally too slow to beat out pokes, grabs, and whatnot. Instead, do 5A -> 5A -> (wait just long enough) -> 5A. If done correctly, your 5A will interrupt the opponent's grab / jab and you can follow up into a 5A -> 6A -> 6C -> blah combo. They shouldn't be out-jabbing / grabbing you during proper 5A spam.

Barrier Cancel your dashes if your opponent does something while you are running at him. You cannot block while running, you can only barrier-block when you are running. A lot of the times where you "lost momentum", you could have just barrier-blocked the reversal attempt. Good times to barrier-cancel your dash are... in reaction to Jin's air 236D, his (really slow) 623C if you see it comming, and especially: distortions. You got the entire super-freeze to just hold back + barrier and hope the barrier comes up in time.

Work on your chain-revolver from mid-screen. It is more flexible than Noel's corner-chain revolver, and it should improve your damage output by a lot.

Block low by default vs Jin. His overhead sucks. Block high when he jumps, watch for the j.D crossup / reverse crossup and you're gold.

You can 3C under Jin's projectiles when he's on the ground. If he throws a projectile at you and you are in 3C range, 3C him and then combo for massive damage.

Learn Noel's Oki game. A well timed 6B on the wakeup can turn a knock-down into another 6B -> 6C -> 2C -> 3C -> Chain Revolver -> knockdown, giving you another chance to 6B on his wakeup. Watch out of course for 623C/D or Distortions... but at very least you should do some wakeup-pressure occasionally to force your opponent into the defensive. Don't let him wakeup for free.

And Oh god. Please don't EVER do that 5D -> 6A -> 5A crap from the DVD. Its the worst ****ing combo I've ever seen in my life. It is terrible on block, and terrible if it hits. You really should _never_ do that.

5D -> 6A -> 5A -> 6A -> 5A -> 236D for what? 1800 damage or something?

Instead, do 5D -> 6C -> 214A -> 2B -> 6C -> j.B -> j.C -> j.236C for ~3.9k damage. Easily more than double your damage output from a 5D.

Against Jin (and only Jin), you can do 5D -> 5C -> 6C -> 5C -> 6C -> 214A -> 2B -> 6C -> j.C -> j.236C for 4.5k+ damage (tiger knee makes it easier).

If you screw up 5D -> (Drive) 6C (you should only do it on hit-confirm... but lets say you screw up), you aren't totally screwed yet. (Drive) 6C -> 5B is a frame trap which will beat out grabs and almost every jab, and (Drive) 6C -> 214D will beat out most dragon-punch / invincibility abuse attempts. Of course, 5D -> 6C has a hole twice the size of Texas so they can probably jab you out of that.

On the other hand, 5D -> (Drive) 6A / 5A is crap on both block and on hit. Don't do it!!

If 6C ever hits them while they are in the air, you can typically follow up with 6C -> BC Loop. If they are "too high" to do a Chain Revolver combo, then finish with an air combo. (2nd hit) 6C counter-hit combos into 6C BC loop in the corner.

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Work on your options from 5C and 2C. I think I only saw you do 2C -> (stop) and 2C -> 3C.. Every 5C you did was followed by 2C. Mix it up a bit. 2C is a low. 2D is an overhead that combos into 2D -> 6A -> 28D -> 6C BC loop -> 5D -> 6B -> etc. etc. From 5C or 2C, force your opponent to react to your 2D / 2C / 3C, or to start throwing out dragon-punches at you. In addition, 2C leaves you with +1 frame advantage, giving you a minor advantage if you want to continue your pressure. (2C -> 66 -> 5A -> more pressure)

Also, for mixup, don't forget that 6B gatlings into 2D as well. A double-overhead is always fun when it hits :-) Be sure to know what to do when 2D is blocked however, you're at a sizable disadvantage if they manage to block 2D.

Noel's mixup is good. Be a bit more random, do more than just 5C -> 2C... remember your options from 5C -> 2D, or 5C -> jump cancel. Learn and work with all of them.

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In your Noel vs Ragna, you did a 2C -> 236236D distortion. Thats decent, but know that the 2C -> Rapid Cancel -> 66A -> 6C -> 5D -> (BnB Chain Revolver) does more damage.

Don't 6C -> 2C your opponents when they whiff an Inferno Divider. Go for 6A -> 6C -> tons of damage. 2C is a combo dead-end. Decent for pressure, safe on block, but if you know you are going to hit them, its best to do something else.

If you want to get better, the only way is to just play better people. You'll start losing your bad habits once you get punished for them every time.

Agreed. In fact, what your _real_ bad habits are probably nothing you recognize. A good opponent will recognize your habits and then punish you for them.

[Kronikhall]

Stagger that 5A. Just 5Aing them over and over at max speed doesn't really do anything, and the 5A -> Dash -> 5A is generally too slow to beat out pokes, grabs, and whatnot. Instead, do 5A -> 5A -> (wait just long enough) -> 5A. If done correctly, your 5A will interrupt the opponent's grab / jab and you can follow up into a 5A -> 6A -> 6C -> blah combo. They shouldn't be out-jabbing / grabbing you during proper 5A spam.

Wait, "Staggering" an attack is delaying it a bit, right?

[dragontamer]

Wait, "Staggering" an attack is delaying it a bit, right?

Yup.

Watch, if you just 5A spam an opponent, he can just block the first one and let auto-guard take care of the rest. He can buffer a grab and the next time you run up to him he'll grab as soon as he's out of guard stun.

On the other hand, if you do 5A -> slight delay -> 5A, you can time it so that the 2nd 5A comes out late enough so that the auto-guard doesn't activate, but it comes out fast enough to beat out the counter-throw attempt.

[Kronikhall]

Yup.

Watch, if you just 5A spam an opponent, he can just block the first one and let auto-guard take care of the rest. He can buffer a grab and the next time you run up to him he'll grab as soon as he's out of guard stun.

On the other hand, if you do 5A -> slight delay -> 5A, you can time it so that the 2nd 5A comes out late enough so that the auto-guard doesn't activate, but it comes out fast enough to beat out the counter-throw attempt.

So that's why I keep getting "Gigantic Tager'd."

[dragontamer]

Well, 720C has invincibility from frame 1 (never vulnerable), and 360A has invincibility on frame 3 (vulnerable for only 2 frames). While staggering makes it harder for the opponent to 360A or 720C you, it doesn't make it impossible. And a well staggered 5A should have a 2-frame hole, which means that both 360A and 720C can beat out staggered 5As. (Both 360B and Tager's normal BC grab are beat by properly staggered 5A... assuming he doesn't instant block you or something) Frame Traps give your opponent an opportunity to counter you, especially Tager who has a 3rd-frame option (360A), and a conditional 1-frame option (236A/B vs Projectiles and 720C with Heat). However, it screws with their auto-block, and most of their options will lose out to a Frame Trap. (A Tager who tries to beat you by using his 5A should lose to a staggered 5A). The other Frame Trap you always do that you probably don't realize... is 5B -> 5C. There's a 2 frame hole IIRC, and a 1-frame hole from 5B -> 2C. Both lose out to Tager's 236A. Basically: Frame Traps against a good Tager generally is... a bad idea. Especially if the frame trap is predictable. IMO, better to play it safe and zone him with 5B outside the range of his grab and what-not. Or, you can always just 5A -> 2B him, because if he's buffering a 360A he probably isn't holding down-back to block the incoming low.

[Kronikhall]

Well, 720C has invincibility from frame 1 (never vulnerable), and 360A has invincibility on frame 3 (vulnerable for only 2 frames).

While staggering makes it harder for the opponent to 360A or 720C you, it doesn't make it impossible. And a well staggered 5A should have a 2-frame hole, which means that both 360A and 720C can beat out staggered 5As. (Both 360B and Tager's normal BC grab are beat by properly staggered 5A... assuming he doesn't instant block you or something)

Frame Traps give your opponent an opportunity to counter you, especially Tager who has a 3rd-frame option (360A), and a conditional 1-frame option (236A/B vs Projectiles and 720C with Heat). However, it screws with their auto-block, and most of their options will lose out to a Frame Trap. (A Tager who tries to beat you by using his 5A should lose to a staggered 5A).

The other Frame Trap you always do that you probably don't realize... is 5B -> 5C. There's a 2 frame hole IIRC, and a 1-frame hole from 5B -> 2C. Both lose out to Tager's 236A.

Basically: Frame Traps against a good Tager generally is... a bad idea. Especially if the frame trap is predictable. IMO, better to play it safe and zone him with 5B outside the range of his grab and what-not.

Or, you can always just 5A -> 2B him, because if he's buffering a 360A he probably isn't holding down-back to block the incoming low.

Actually to be honest I've already stopped doing 5B->5C. When I was lurking around, I read that it was generally an unsafe string to do. And yeah, 5A->2B is something I've been using alot more lately.

It probably also doesn't help that I'm fighting against a Hell Tager, who has godly timing on all of his moves. It's hard to find any player that doesn't have a blue connection to practice with.

[dragontamer]

Its perfectly safe vs Rachel, Taokaka, Staffless Litchi, Bang, Mirror Match Noel, Carl and Nu. These guys only have defensive options between 5B -> 5C (ie: backdash, counter-assault or whatever) So both Staggered 5As and the 5B -> 5C hole can only hurt your opponent. Well... they can spend 50% heat on a distortion but that is not typically in the gameplan of these characters. A blocked 5C is a semi-free mixup for Noel. 5C -> 2C is perfectly safe, leaves you with a +1 frame advantage to continue pressure if you want to (2C -> 5B for example), and has the option of 3C / 2D as a mixup. Enough 5C -> 2Cs and you'll train the opponent to block low on instinct... giving you the opportunity to 5C -> 2D the opponent which needs to be blocked high. Even against Tager, 5C out ranges his 360A at least, and leads to a jump cancel -> rising j.C. It can be used decently for pressure. I think 5C is a very useful part of Noel's Mixup game. Getting to 5C involves risk vs defensive attacks (like Hakumen's counter or Tager's 360A), but that doesn't mean you should remove it from your gameplan.

[archling]

I don't like 5C in block strings. Too much commitment. I like to keep my block strings at a casual relationship.