ryokoalways Posted October 10, 2009 Posted October 10, 2009 The hit following 6A only does 53% damage. Prorate out the ass baby. Unless you are going for the kill, you don't burn more than 2 magatamas after 6A and 6B.
Leonil_Requiem Posted October 10, 2009 Posted October 10, 2009 wow i just tech trap some by 66 J214B jc falling JC land 5C (Corner) 623 AA J2C j2C air dash j2c j2c j2c but yea i'm just expressing combos, you don't have you use them http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IecDplsIs3U
rtl42 Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 go "just express combos" in the combos thread, this is video and discussion.
qwerty Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 that first match made me scream at my screen in rage. "WHAT WHY ARE YOU BACK TECHING INTO THE CORNER HES GOING TO 72- GOD DAMMIT"
MadRhetoric Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 I kept wondering why he never combo'd off anything. Ok I can maybe see having trouble hit confirming a 2B or something but come on, you land a CH j.C or 5C its time to combo.
qwerty Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 i think he either choked or just lacked matchup experience. possibly both. his lack of hotaru was disturbing, to say the least.
MisoSowee Posted October 11, 2009 Posted October 11, 2009 that first match made me scream at my screen in rage. "WHAT WHY ARE YOU BACK TECHING INTO THE CORNER HES GOING TO 72- GOD DAMMIT" I also cried a little on the inside. *COUGH* TURTLE HAKU PLEASE *COUGH*
SimpleKiss Posted October 12, 2009 Posted October 12, 2009 i think he either choked or just lacked matchup experience. possibly both. his lack of hotaru was disturbing, to say the least. Someone needs to do the old pope image photoshopped over Darth vader, only with a picture of hakumen, and quoting this.
bjholmes2 Posted October 13, 2009 Posted October 13, 2009 These videos are helping me out a lot. Thank you! Also, SimpleKiss, this is for you: I made it in Paint. Can you tell?
MisoSowee Posted October 13, 2009 Posted October 13, 2009 Godlike. You are a valuable addition to the ev- er good side.
MadRhetoric Posted October 13, 2009 Posted October 13, 2009 haha oh wow I thought I was the only one who thought of Vader when I read qwerty's post, and then I come back and see clearly I wasn't. except I imagined it more along the lines of Tager saying it while force choking Haku-men.
ryokoalways Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 TJL(HK) vs YW(NO) In my friend's defense (and partially me), switching from HDMI to RCA on HD TV caused enough lag to screw up his combo ability. He doesn't drop combos.
Sophisticat Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 Not much to say here other than I'm going to be taking notes as there's a lot I've never seen before. I could be ultra picky and note plenty of stuff I find wrong, but this is a match between friends and overall it's way above-average in terms of skill so a lot of it is probably over my head. Though I will note it's a weird playstyle I've never seen before out of a Haku (unless that was the lag? :P). Meaning: all those random j.a's, 5a's, 2b's and 5b's were to bait/trap? Looks kind of reckless to me, but what do I know? Otherwise, the final double hop to bait burst was a great finisher. I'm going to be using that!
ryokoalways Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 I'm going to be shameless and say that a lot of crap is due to lag. Also, remember it's a friend, so he has been through a lot of conditioning. Somethings do not work immediately against players you first play. And a lot of things I do are baits. Feel feel to figure them out. Lastly, feel free to critique. I make a load of mistakes just like everyone else. I've looked at the vids already, but anything I may have missed is good to know. I am going to post a better set of matches against him later. Edit: This means this batch is with CRT, so 0 Lag. Hello Instant block~.
MadRhetoric Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 Your combo choices seem weird to me. I mean combos tend to be personal preference a lot of times but you seemed to use 5C > gurren > 6C a lot, even in situations where another combo would have been better. Like off of 6B counter hit falling j.c > 2C > j.2C > j.C does better damage for no meter, and gets you more meter because of the length of number of hits, and if its spacing you want you can just replace the final j.C with j.2C for pretty much the same position as 6C. also inbetween 5C and enma putting gurren only does 300 or so damage and prorates the rest of the air combo so it seems hardly worth the meter.
ryokoalways Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 I use the 6C ender because it provides me better positioning. This is more for against that guy specifically. If I do your variation, I'm at a disadvantage afterwards. He knows noel's slide pokes at that distance and it's too dangerous for me to do most things. And gurren is more for hit confirming purposes. I didn't trust my reaction with lag there. Hell, I don't trust it even without lag sometimes. Much safer to gurren than to kishuu on a block. But you are right, just 5C enma is better.
ryokoalways Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 TJL(HK) vs YW(NO) #2 TJL(HK) vs YW(NO) #3 Still the lag batch. Edit: And the no lag ones. TJL(HK) vs YW(NO) #4 TJL(HK) vs YW(NO) #5 TJL(HK) vs YW(NO) #6 TJL(HK) vs YW(NO) #7
qwerty Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 hot shit ryoko. couple of things. off of an anti air 5A counter hit, i'm pretty sure you can jump cancel into j.A j.B late gatling j.C/j.2C. i would test it right now but i dont have a copy of bb where i'm staying at the moment. also, whenever i land a normal ground hit with 6A, i'll sometimes wait until they recover and then do 6B, because i've noticed a tendency for people to guard high. of course, attempting a frame trap like you did is a safer option, but sometimes it's gimmicks that win you matches (although one might argue the 6A -> 6B frame trap is a gimmick in and of itself!). and lastly, in the first match you landed a 6B counter hit, 5C and then noel bursted- i'm pretty sure you were at the range where had you 6C'd instead, you could've killed her with shippu during recovery. but yeah good matches. if you have trouble with air throws, hotarus and counters these matches are worth watching for some edit: semi-related question since the first few were in lag, does advance input apply to instant blocks?
Spark Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 Off 5A CH in the air you actually have enough time to hit with 5C/2C. Though hit confirming that is rough.
ryokoalways Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 You are right qwerty. I don't combo on 5A counter at the moment because I am not use to it yet, but it's something I want to do. Right now I reflexively just hop after 5A. Kind of like I sometimes reflexively do 5C, gurren, enma, rather than just 5C enma. Needs to be fixed. Noted on the delayed 6B. Noted the failed bait on first match. Glad you enjoyed the match. Edit: I don't believe advanced input applies to directions, so no.
seyu Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 now that its mentioned id have a question: after a non CH 6B what would be the best method to follow up? ive been goin with gurren until now but ive been overusing that pretty much lately. especially after a 3C CH.
Sophisticat Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 Hot damn, that's some good stuff. I've really been in need of evolving my playstyle and I really like yours, so don't mind if I copy stuff. The issues I had previously were due to lag, so they no longer apply. I'll only comment on two things: you seem to be big on positioning, but I also notice a lack of j.2c in some combos to send the other guy into the corner. For example, after a 6d you went -> f.C -> 2c (can't recall if this was here) -> 5c -> gurren -> 6c. Why no j.2c after the 2c? Lack of damage when you're already pushing him into the corner? No Zantetsu? There's a lot of herding/traps/baits, but a lack of hard hits. Needs more Zantetsu. Besides that, the stuff that needs to be improved has already been mentioned, meaning the 5a issue and doing 5c -> gurren -> enma instead of straight 5c -> enma. Now you just need vids against a non-Noel player. And that Noel is good. Rare to see one get his loops right.
ryokoalways Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 Against him I really do not like to remove too much tech time with j2c and have to be coming in via an air approach. Most of the air dash I did were after he got knockdown, or at a timing where he can't get his 6a/ja/air throw out fast enough to AA me (I mean, he has to guess between jb, jc, and hotaru, so it's not exactly in his favor if I time it right). You saw how he was blowing me out of the air if I air dashed in from neutral. Hakumen has no real means of beating noel's ja. That shit clashes with everything. Against other characters, say, bang or ragna, you guys are right that the basic 2c > j2c combo is better. I only zantetsu if I get very specific hits. In these matches. I had 2-3 chances I think, but didn't react fast enough. Only time I will bring out zantetsu outside of those instances is if I'm going for the kill, but most of my setups allows me to just shippu, so I do that instead. Edit: non-counter 6B can be followed up with enma for about 3k. Not too bad. Edit2: I don't think I actually answered your question on positioning clearly enough. I'm not looking to push him into the corner in the cases that are brought up. I'm trying to get the correct spacing against the noel player. Noel's slide speed makes her moves go farther than they actually are (similar to how millia and chipp has fairly long range. Jam doesn't count because her hitbox still sucks. Only move Jam has that works well is 2S). This means I either get out ranged (beats 5A, 2A, 5B, 2B, situationally dependent) or his move just comes out faster (beats all C moves, minus 3C, but that's too risky to use too often). Which is why I usually only take one step towards her and stop, because at that distance the advantage is mine. Only certain instances do I push her towards the corner via hop spam.
yunwei Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 Too bad that I only play Noel. But even that I still make a lot of stupid mistakes and drop combos. Ryoko plays a rush down hakuman, and it's quite effective against me. It's really hard to see those overheads, and I kept falling for those traps. It's really hard to counter those hotarus. Also, instant block gives hakuman a big meter gain. Probably should utilize that. Ryoko is probably gonna post some vids against Ragna sooner or later. But we don't have a large pool of characters here
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