Sophisticat

Another Haku with advice... Imo, Makoto is gimped here. I usually feel like I can control all space in this match, so your approach is limited. Don't jump in like a loon, either, I can hit you for 4k with just 2 stars. Also, I can j.D your anti-airs if you're being obvious. Throws don't condition against counters because I use them on reaction (i.e., if you're being predictable, you're dead). And since I reaction stuff, then if I anticipate your next move, you're still dead. Remember, Haku specializes in taking apart other's offense. That said, Makoto's best bet is to mix it up as much as possible. Don't use blockstrings with gaps because I'll TK Hotaru or 1f counter. Block if you know there's a gap, and maybe I'll mess up and you can CH me. Although, I personally really don't see what Makoto can do in this match that doesn't carry some sort of risk (granted, I don't know her all that well). Haku is simply superior in everything here. Play it smart, bait counters/retaliations, and don't be predictable is the best advice I can give.

So I just thought about this today, and turns out it works! Not sure if this was already known, but whatever. In the corner, renka(2) -> 5c combos at the right height! :D Not sure if it has practical applications, but damage seems a bit higher on 3-4 star combos. Needs testing.

I see what you mean, but my point is that she wasn't designed as a defensive character. She's a zoner with an offensive streak. Obviously, they nerfed her too much so she now has to be much more defensive than intended. But by design, I don't believe she's meant to be defensive.

Top defensive is definitely Hakumen, his entire playstyle is centered around being defensive. You can RTSD, but you need the meter. Others who are more defensive-centered than the rest, in no order: Tager, Jin, Lambda, Mu. I contest Rachel, Hazama, and Bang. Bang is all about pressuring until you get in a hit, and Rachel's defense is real shitty. They don't thrive on being defensive. Hazama is more of a hit-and-run offensive character than a defensive one since he basically zones/harasses/mixes up then runs away until he gets in a hit. We shouldn't confuse a stupid good reversal as emblematic of an entire playstyle.

My theory is that it did not gain the ability to cut projectiles because it's now air unblockable (at least, I don't recall it ever having this property in CT). So it gained in AA usefulness while not getting something else. Works out perfectly fine to me, since you got plenty of other stuff that deals better with projectiles anyway.

LOL, yeah, I noticed this yesterday too, fighting the new Ara for the first time. Maybe a glitch? It's not that bad though, since all other C's make a void out of it.

Ok, so new Litchi is In CT, the corner wasn't that bad. Now, it's just . Tips on handling her when you're stuck there?

Hum, guess I'll work on the stuff mentioned in here. I don't have too much trouble per se (it's at least no longer my worst match like in CT), it's just some of his traps and shenanigans I have trouble avoiding/knowing how to punish. Zan? It's not that good outside of combos. Tsubaki's the better overhead. You don't need consistent big damage on Tager, just Hotaru in your arsenal since it's 3.7k at the minimum. Yeah, it's good if you condition them to block low. Combos: (0 stars) -> 2c -> j.2a -> AD j.2a -> j.C (Whatever) -> 5c -> whatever.

So I played the guy who won our city-wide CS tourney (yours truly didn't do too shabby, finishing top 8. *cough* I digress...), and I gotta say Tager can still be a pain to deal with. So, Q #1: After Gadget Finger, does Hotaru beat out anything Tager does outside of backdash? I feel like Hotaru and j.D are my only ways of getting damage against a good Tager who knows his defense. Poking with j.C and 4c, and waiting out until you have stars isn't always good because he has Spark Bolt. So, Q #2: what are my best opportunities to get in damage?

^ Even in my limited online experience, I can tell you that Makoto isn't that high. She has no reach, and no way to force her way in. She has big damage, but she has to land a move first. Kind of missing an important element to make her good, imo. Not quite sure what it is yet that would be aligned with her theme, though. More Chipp illusions shenanigans, probably. Make her more "squirelly". Then we'd be going somewhere.

^ I doubt you can cut it on reaction. It is pretty fast. From playing a couple decent Makotos online, I think I can say with some certainty (however much online can give) that Hakumen should have complete control of this match. Quite simply, she has no reach, and no real way to get in. Even if she does get in close, her mix-up sucks. Watch for the punch overhead, don't get hit by smash super, and know how her 3c and 3-Makotos illusion thing work. Also, at the right distance, her ball projectile is 4c reactable for a void disruption. Be careful of jumping in because she has that air unblockable DP of hers. Always barrier, or j.D if you're confident. I disrecommend coming to Makoto; it's too easy to mess up and eat a parry loop. Let her work to get in, and punish with big damage of your own. She has power, but, imo, she shouldn't be able to touch you once you know the matchup. S'all I got, hope it's accurate.

After 4c CH, you can: - 3c x2 - Hop -> 3c x2 Distance dependent: - Enma -> etc. - Gurren -> enma -> etc. (preferably only for corner) - 5c -> enma -> etc. Imo, these are your best options. Just don't spend stars on 4c, it scales too much. EDIT: Or Entnerv's option into staircase -> j.C. Didn't know about that one.

I got it~~ !! :D I can hit Hotaru (note: counter hit) -> j.2c -> 5c x2 fairly consistently now (if >20% of the time is consistent, lawl). Found out the trick, at least. Goddamn. About time. Okay, first, Ryoko's previous post responding to me is the best advice you can get. The height at which you hit j.2c is the one that decides whether 5c x2 will hit or not (though Hotaru delay is also a factor). The best thing to do to find this optimal j.2c (EDIT: hitbox, too) height is to go to Haku's challenge #9, use sample play, and view it for yourself. From there, you manually find out the correct timing to hit j.2c. Practice like Hell, then you got it. :D I might make a detailed vid, actually. It's ambiguous enough to ask for extra visual help like that. O ya. I don't sj., actually, I just hit 5a at the right height. Might be the better idea, really, but I thought I'd throw out the sj. option for those who'd prefer it or if 5a does hit too high.

Well, you could just sj. every time and save yourself some timing/spacing recognition problems. But I find that if 5a hits them just below Haku's arm, you might need an sj. It'll connect on some characters, but I'd sj. just to be safe. This is different from CT, though. I don't think I've ever needed to sj. back then.

Note: you sj. if the 5a hits too high. Otherwise, normal jump.

Man, Ryoko, I can't thank you enough. You always have the good info. What do we owe you by now? A Jam Dakimakura? xD

Two recent vids from Acho with Haku: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RM4XP4p8JPo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYSIsE2GyAo When I first saw them, I got pretty frustrated with the Haku. I thought he played much too cautiously, and got killed because he didn't take enough risks. But now that I've played CS, I'd like a second opinion. Is there some merit to what he does?

Yes. If you walk forward, 5c will hit with the tip. It's a damage/positioning variant if you don't want to go for Throw > Gurren > hop 5a/2b/5b > etc.

Thanks, Ryoko. Hitting it still isn't consistent, but it's coming. That said, 5c x2 is surprisingly easy if you do a 5c AA. It's also not too bad if your starter is a j.2c air hit. It seems that the later in the combo you try to go for that link, the harder it gets. @Skylos: you don't need to sj. the j.2a, fyi. There is a delay before you can do the AD. Try waiting half to a full second before hitting the AD. Or mash it out until you "get" it.

That was one of its uses in CT. It's one way to reverse positions if you're in the corner, have 4 stars and manage a throw. However, I actually disrecommend using the forward version. This variant is better, because you still get 4k, but for 3 stars and more pushback: Throw > Gurren > 5c > Enma > j.2c > 2c > j.2a > AD j.2a > j.C Imo, the bj. version is the one worth doing because of its situational use, whereas fj. is inefficient.

Okay, so it turns out that completing Haku #9 was a complete fluke. Linking j.2c to 5c x2 is fucking ridiculous. It's like GG suddenly invaded BB. What I got so far: - Hop hotaru seems to have the highest rate of success. - From here, you have two choices: delay Hotaru and/or delay j.2c. - Whichever you choose to delay, the optimal hitbox height seems to fall slightly above Haku once you hit with j.2c. - I think there's also about 1-2 frames you can delay before the other can tech out after j.2c hit where you can play with a 5c delay. Needs confirm. Now, if all this weren't enough, this is where the rage comes in. I'll often hit 5c with the very tip, as supposed to, but the second 5c will not come out. This is driving me nuts. Help?

Off j.C CH on grounded opponent, you can do: > 5c > Enma > yadda yadda. Regular f.C combo nets you 3115 dmg, and renka before the enma nets you 3489. If you have to do gurren instead of 5c because of distance, regular f.C gives 2816. EDIT: Yeehaw, old reversal combo off throw still works! Throw > Renka(1)-Enma > bj.2a > ADb j.2a > j.2c > [5c > gurren > 6c] or [2c > j.2a > AD j.2a > j.C] Not sure how much dmg it does since I can't pull it off yet because the spacing changed. However, off throw > renka-enma > fj. yadda yadda, you net yourself 4292. Note: ADb = air dash backwards, bj. = back jump, and fj. = forward jump.

I thought it was obvious it worked given the amount it staggers on CH? Regardless, I've already used it effectively in matches, and I can say it's cool to have. Now to add my own contributions... I see the section under Zantetsu is severely lacking. Is Zan no longer that good for damage? You can still do these CT combos, slightly modified for CS: - (7) Renka-Zan > 5c > Enma > j.2c > 2c > j.2a > AD j.2a > j.C (~6k, I forget. Also not optimized for max dmg, so I ask people to please test this one out. My time with CS is limited until next week) - (corner only) (8) [6c] FC > [6c] > Renka-Zan > 5c > Zan > 2c > [corner loop to be optimized] (I haven't found the best loop yet, but I can say it breaks 10k!!!!) First combo could also be optimized for best starter.

Thanks, man. With that I just finished Haku's challenges. The spacing is an issue when you're not used to it, but once you get it, you'll hit it every time (training mode, at least). If you need any help with the challenges, just hit me up.

Whoa-o has some stuff changed in CS. Spacing seems much more important in combos now. That said, I'm trying out Haku's challenge #9, and I can't get 5c x2 to get out. I'm using hop hotaru if that changes anything. Now, I have figured out the timing for the 5c x2 link. It's just that going from j.2c to 5c x2 is a bit ambiguous. The sample play shows that j.2c should be done as low as possible, so I'm thinking Bang's height has something to do with it. Any help?