[CS1] Carl Clover Tactical Discussion/Questions/Help

[ZONG_one]

If Nirvana will be nearby (close behind after IAD Allecan,)

FCH j.B > land IAD > j.2C Allecan > 5C > sj.B > j.C > 623D > dj.C > dj.2C > Allegretto.

(Probably the most practical combo.)

If Nirvana isn't nearby, leave out the 623D and possibly j.2C depending on character/height you're at.

[Akanishi]

Cool, thanks.

[Ca$$iu$ Check$]

Whadup people. I've been lurking on these forums since CT's console release without really contributing anything. Learned a lot from these forums though, so thanks to all that have contributed. I've been eagerly awaiting CS's console release, and been watching tons of youtube vids to satiate my desire to get my hands on the game. I recently started thinking about dash allegretto and had some theory fighter ideas I wanted to throw out. I kinda wanted to wait til the release to test em myself, so I wouldn't seem dumb if they are completely useless, but anyway here goes:

A. Situation is C-O-N, and Carl has dragged a combo out to the point when the opponent can tech soon, so he ends it in 8D (so that the opponent is in untechable free fall). I see a lot of players do this because its good for oki. My question is, while the opponent is falling, does Carl have enough time to connect a dash allegretto on the falling opponent? If so, was thinking of these situations:

1. If it connects, opponent is hit with the full hits and is blown back into nirvana. Then if there's time Nirvana attacks with something. 623D would be the fastest, but opponent would likely tech after and so you'd lose oki

2. If it connects, and the opponent is hit, but maybe not all of the hits are able to connect because opponent can tech after initial hits. So now it's like a really tight C-O-N, with Carl finishing dash allegretto or landing from it, and opponent in the air after air tech, and Nirvana behind him. I'm assuming the opponent can't air tech forward through Carl, or back through Nirvana, so they are stuck there. Now what if Nirvana has done 8D during the dash allegretto, making it an air tech trap. If it lasts long enough to still be active after the air tech's invincibility and hits the opponent, can Carl land and reset with like 5B or something into new combo?

This may all be silly stuff that doesn't even work but I was curious and don't have the game to even check it out.

[ZONG_one]

Your opponent would just not tech.

Any smart person is going to wait from the free fall until they hit the ground, to try and see what kind of oki you're setting up.

If they get hit by that dash allegretto, they won't tech, and your combo won't reset. the damage/nirvana meter you're going to spend probably won't be worth it, and they'll tech out at a safe time. Also, you'll lose oki.

(not even sure if it would work, btw. But no real point in trying it, imo.)

It's one of those things where if it did work on someone, it would probably never work again, as it was a gimmick, and a very easy one to see once it's happening.

[Akira-Shiro]

Can carl still cancel a IAD with a barrier block

[Kyle]

the real question is:

Can allegreto cancel your airdash? The biggest problem right now with carl's throw break/UB set-up is the airdash has so many frames when Carl can't act, this offers enough for for the opponent to jump away or throw some great move out...

I'll look into throw break, airdash canceled allegreto to force a block & 8]D[ situation.

Great idea. Hope it works

[Kyle]

Welcome ZONG_one as a new moderator!

[Zoogstin]

Yaay. Good stuff Zong.

[Prophet]

Welcome ZONG_one as a new moderator!

Awesooome!

[Roldy]

Aww...Toronto is sad...

But still, welcome Zong_one!

[Akira-Shiro]

Noo i mean cancel a IAD into a barrier block, ur essentially pressing 866>5D> 4ABD(hold D)

This lets carl cancel his dash animation with his "activate nirvana" animation, this gives u the ability to go into a barrier block.

[Xithmos]

This thread needs more love. D:

[Roldy]

So, I'm trying to put in Volante in my combos...but it seems hard to connect. Do you do Volante after a 5C or before it?

As in, 5C > 421D > Volante hits

or is it 421D > 5C > Volante hits?

And also, besides 5C, is there any other way to connect a Volante into a combo?

[feri]

j.2c~allecan+volante

j.2c~allecan > 4214c+d

volante > j.2c~allecan also works

I have more issues hitting them low enough with j.2c.

[Zoogstin]

Carl Frame Data now up.

http://dustloop.com/guides/bbcs/frameData/carl.html

[ZONG_one]

Welcome ZONG_one as a new moderator!

So when does my name get to look as cool as yours?

Thanks guys.

Noo i mean cancel a IAD into a barrier block, ur essentially pressing 866>5D> 4ABD(hold D)

This lets carl cancel his dash animation with his "activate nirvana" animation, this gives u the ability to go into a barrier block.

I discussed this earlier. Yes, you can still do this.

No need to continue holding D after barrier, either. :]

Still, by the looks of it, uses for this are going to be few and far between.

More to be posted if anything groundbreaking/consistently viable is discovered.

I have more issues hitting them low enough with j.2c.

This is the thing that gives me the most problems as well.

Also, thanks for that DeM FrAMeZ, Zoogs.

[ZONG_one]

Disregard this post. My apologies.

[Akiro]

Grats on Mod Zong ;O.

Btw, whats the timing on the 2D loop again?

I'm doing j.2c 2D j.5c.

Either the 2D blue beats or the j.5c whiffs ;-;, i swear this combo hates me

[Roldy]

I release D while pressing C at the same time. Works every time.

J.2C should come out the same time as 2D.

Edit: I meant that 2D should start at the same time J.2C does. Not 2D and J.2C hit at the same time.

[Eshi]

dang, carl is much more difficult to get used to than I thought. 2D loop isn't a problem but I'm having a ton of trouble with volante. Any advice on how/when to work it in to juggles?

[Akiro]

I agree, Carl is much more harder to learn this time, I swear the timing on Catabile combos is a bit more strict. I haven't gotten to Volante Combos yet however,

Thanks for the help btw Roldy, I got the 2D loop down now :D.

[soujiro seta]

lmao i thought i was the only one. I dont have a prob with his 2d/4d loop. Infact it's easier to do 2d/4d combos in CS for me. Right now I can get volante combos about 60% of the time. It's his resets that I seem to be dropping alot. Like i'm attempting some of the stuff from the reset thread and I'm dropping them like crazy. It's taking me longer to get used to him than I thought. He has a kind of "floaty" feel to him, or is it just me. I'd say he's def a lot harder and more technical to play now.

Although all this could be because I'm just getting used to his overall CS feel.

[Mr Oso]

Yeah trying to drop old habits of carl from CT. Yeah hes more tech but i like the feel of it.Working on picking up some stuff from that one Carl combo vid and also the Tutorial CS vid. Itz a work in progress

[ZONG_one]

Yes, your 2D should be released the moment you hit j.2C. From there, wait a second and tap j.C (NO MASHING OMFG@!#@)

Volante is trickier. You use it only in combos you started with something that prorates relatively well. (Probably 5B, 5C, 6D, clap, air CH volante, 2D, allecan, etc.)

The trick (not really a trick) is to hit them as low as you can with your Alle-can. After that it's just input consistency on your part.

Usually I go Allecan > volante input > 5C > Volante hits > allecan > j.B > j.C > clap > j.2C rep.

I've also seen allecan > 5C > j.B > clap/ j.2C > j.C > dj.B > clap, as follow ups to volante hits.

4D combos are ones I haven't really gotten into yet.

Soujiro, It seems like if I try to input 4D with the same timing as volante in the allecan combo, it whiffs.

It'll look something like.. whatever > j.2C allecan > 4]D[C > j.C. My Jump B/C will hit, but the 4D won't.

How early should I be inputting the 4D?

Should it be j.2C 214C]D[ > 5C > j.B?

[Zoogstin]

wait so you don't combine the allecan and volante inputs ala 4214?