ZONG_one Posted June 23, 2010 Posted June 23, 2010 They can tech back, out of range of 3C/behind Nirvana. Depends on the timing, but neutral tech is really the only time you can get an unblock, unless you get lucky and tech trap their roll with 3C/5C/2B/etc.
soujiro seta Posted June 23, 2010 Posted June 23, 2010 Cool little mixup: whatever > [j.2C > j.C > 2D] x2 > j.2C > allegretto > clap. Ok here's the oki. (Potential to punish back roll and neutral tech. Won't punish forward roll, but you'll be safe on forward roll, and they probably won't want to roll forward, as back/neutral are their two most favorable options in sandwich oki.) 2D Before tech > On neutral/back tech, IAD > j.2C allecan crossup > 2D hits > Vivace A back into sandwich j.2C loop. DP will beat this, of course. What do you guys think? haha that's exactly one of the resets in the reset thread, except it's done on wakeup. Nice to see you looking for stuff zong Don't worry guys, i found a bunch of new stuff, just when I thought there was nothing left. Lol, at this rate I'm starting to wonder if I made a mistake attempting a reset/strat thread. All I have to do now is just type it up, but I've been so busy with other stuff, procrastinating too much, and I haven't been in the mood. Don't worry I'll try and get up by at least saturday cause if I don't I don't think I ever will.
ZONG_one Posted June 23, 2010 Posted June 23, 2010 Yeah, I do it on wake up too. Sorry for being late to the party, souj. :]
Marionette Pwii Posted June 24, 2010 Posted June 24, 2010 XDD a a a a it's actually spammable now?or is it some kind of strategy to use?O:
njmamm Posted June 24, 2010 Posted June 24, 2010 i sometimes jump in with j.aaaaa into combo lol turns out it's an overhead... o.o
Adelheid Posted June 24, 2010 Posted June 24, 2010 XDD a a a a it's actually spammable now?or is it some kind of strategy to use?O: People do it against nirvana, it's not a carl thing.
ZONG_one Posted June 24, 2010 Posted June 24, 2010 If you jump in and actually hit with j.AAAAAAA, your combo is going to be about 2 more hits when you hit the ground. Your proration will be shot to shit, and you won't get a combo. Only time to use it is to force block for clap to hit, or maybe something like j.AAA > 2A > 5A > 2A > 7j.66 > allecan mixup.
Prophet Posted June 24, 2010 Posted June 24, 2010 If you jump in and actually hit with j.AAAAAAA, your combo is going to be about 2 more hits when you hit the ground. Your proration will be shot to shit, and you won't get a combo. Only time to use it is to force block for clap to hit, or maybe something like j.AAA > 2A > 5A > 2A > 7j.66 > allecan mixup. Is j.AAAAA Allegretto into clap as a tech trap viable?
ZONG_one Posted June 24, 2010 Posted June 24, 2010 I don't think j.A gatlings to Allegretto, so no. I mean. Tech traps usually are something that can't be blocked easily. IE throw tech trap, or air unblockable tech trap. They'll be able to block allegretto. Clap, on the other hand is a great tech trap. But the allegretto isn't going to help that at all. And after all, it's not a tech trap if it all combos.
Adelheid Posted June 25, 2010 Posted June 25, 2010 They'll be able to block allegretto, but that won't help them get out of the clap. Also, doesn't gatling? Allegretto is a special move, and you can special cancel jump A.
ZONG_one Posted June 25, 2010 Posted June 25, 2010 Yes, it's special cancellable, meaning you can cancel it into anything (eventhough allegretto is his only aerial special move, isn't it? lol.), but I'm 99% it still won't gatling. I'll try it tonight and let you know if it combos. j.A has like no hit stop, and allegretto start up is so slow. I don't know how it would work. Though I've never really had a point in doing j.A > Allegretto.
Adelheid Posted June 25, 2010 Posted June 25, 2010 Gatling cancel is just... Cancelling from a normal to another normal... I'm not sure since I haven't actually played BlazBlue in about a month and have no real interest in the game anymore, but I'm pretty sure the idea is to keep them from teching forward after A mash by using allegretto to be a wall they have to block, only to get hit by the clap. It's weak, but, eh. Might work.
njmamm Posted June 25, 2010 Posted June 25, 2010 well, i mean i exaggerated a little bit i guess more like j.a 2x/3x into combo and cuz of the stuff u just mentioned id go for a reset or a block string and combo attempt if they block since they'd now be stuck in between (if ada doesn't happen to be right there id either go 5b 6b > cantabile > 5b > air combo or 5b > IAD > alle-can on block since ill be hit confirming) tho my most common jump in is a low j.b b/c of the horizontal range, and it works most of the time
Zeero Posted June 25, 2010 Posted June 25, 2010 pretty sure they can forward tech and the invincibility would get them out of the allegretto no?
Kyle Posted June 25, 2010 Posted June 25, 2010 Zeero- Woah, man. What are you doing around here. lol Hope all is well. & on topic: Nah, it's semi-legit. I did this shit against Haku & Tager in CT days. I will be digging through this thread and updating the 101 shortly. Thanks for the format Zeero. =D To update:/VERIFY C-O-N 2B, 2C, 632146C, 2]D[, 2B, 2C, 632146C, 2]D[... Guard Crush on (6)-primers into a Super launch, Nee~san should recover in time to 8]D[. Dashing allegreto for zoning Anima break stuff Post#290 shows color pallet Astral applications? 6,4,6,41236]D[ LambCHop jump loops: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_RlFUMw8QQ J.2C, J.B, J.C & 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B W/ sister helping pushback. PahethonH: Dunno if this has been mentioned before, but I figured I'd toss it out here: Nirvana's commands are now with respect to actual spatial relations instead of Carl's direction. So, for example, C-O-N airdash right to become O-C-N (j.), once past the opponent, Carl is facing right (i.e. "forward" D). In BBCT, right-D () would be 6D because Carl is facing right; but now in BBCS, now that "true sides" are switched, right-D () in this situation becomes 4D even though Carl is facing right (i.e. "away" D). Carl's own commands are still based on the direction he faces, though. i.e. in the above situation, Allegretto/Alle-can is still down-downleft-left (), CT and CS. In short, the rules for Nirvana commands in crossups is different in BBCS. 3C cross under oki. like CT haku. Phaethon wavedashing: Also, dash Allegretto is not an air attack -- it can be blocked low. EDIT: more warning: nominal wavedash is 66 214C 66 214C etc., but a late-C wavedashing gets you 66(3)214C (land) 6{auto-fire C}6 -> Laetabilis Cantata. Wavedashing Carl is more finicky than I expected. BURST & CA damage: We lost clap loop off of Burst/Counter Assault: But supers do a set minimum DMG. -Burst, 8]D[, 632146C, 8]D[, 632146C for at least 1500 DMG. (DMG needs confirmed) -Counter assault, 8]D[, 632146C, for at least 750 DMG. (DMG needs confirmed) -Counter assault, 623D, J.B, Allegreto, 8]D[, 632146C, for at least 750 DMG. (DMG needs confirmed) My corner break set-up needs more work... I'm still investigating low throw and high throw and optiml set-ups BnBs. FOR COMBO THREAD: What is the situation you are trying for here? I can test this all pretty easily, but I need to make sure I know the situation, because otherwise this isn't going to always be 100% accurate because of course hitstun imparted is not just a measure of a move's level and how many hits are already in the combo, but of a move's level and how many of what hits are already in the combo. So different situations are going to mean different amounts here; 5A > 5B won't even hit 7 hits going on 8 off of 2A 5A 5B 5C (6D) 2A 5A 5B, but it will off of (6D) jC 5B 5C (6D) jC 5A 5B, for instance. Meanwhile, 5B 5C (41236D) 2A 5A 2A 5A 5B will work, even though that's 13 hits going on 14. EDIT: And yeah, 5A 2B gatlings. This, is exactly what I was going for. THX Stark. FUZZY STUFF: 6B doesn't jump cancel on guard. wait... or does it in CS? Use 5B instead. Even if he blocks low J.B wil hit as an overhead. FuzzyGuard- The idea that as a character low blocks their hitbox is actually as big as their standing sprite on the firsth hit they actually crouch for. So, 5B, (Ragna standing), J.B (Ragna crouch), should hit as an overhead. Only problem is being able to pickup off of a J.B at that height with Ragna crouching in hitstun.... J.B, J.C maybe. OH OH 5B, J.B, 236236D. Evil <-- Stark: Question. In you can IB something and counterhit with air dash jA, then wouldn't the correct punish up close be jB, not jA? You can straight up jB faster than you can air dash jA, I'm pretty sure, and fatal counter jB is certainly going to get you more than just counterhit jA. COMBO THREAD: (2) hit's of clap Cantata on aerial opponent?!? Not to ruin the party or anything but 5B is -1 on block and very quickly since these will probably be the ones people care most about. On BLock 5A -3 5B -1 5C -4 2A - 4 2B +0 6B -2 6C +0 resume your conversations =) More astral strats: Deus Ex Machina = TROLLING TOOL OF CHAMPIONS With full meter, retreat to the corner with IAD, 22D during it to position Ada like this: |.......A...............| | = screen border; this assumes you're going to the right, for left otherwise Ada would be similarly positioned towards the right. Activate AH as soon as possible, then just FD everything they do, and tech whatever throws they used. If you have good defense you can easily keep this up for the mere five seconds it takes for it to go off; when you're cornered like this they can't back the screen away enough to dodge the explosion, and FDing their attacks will push them into it. If they don't attack you can just 5B or something. I've gotten this off three times tonight and I got Veteru to complain and jestingly call it cheap, which makes me pretty happy That diagram is awful, so I'll try to get video footage of this as soon as I can. Luckily my HD capture device recently arrived in the mail so I should be able to get a good quality capture of it. This is obviously not a 100% serious strategy since Carl kinda likes using his meter, but goddamn. It is very funny and there's really not a whole lot they can do about it so if you somehow get the chance you really might as well. The only real hole is people with command grabs (except tager lololol) you can't just easily tech their throws. Also, Rachel can dodge it by staying in the air and just not going down. I think Arakune might be able to do the same thing. Noel maybe if she has lots of meter. But, uh, against people who don't have command throws and aren't those characters! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJyUZ2Zyy44 Dio combo forcing opponent into corner. GREEN ANIMA'S Trying to force a green throw: During the [j5C 5B 5C 6D]xN combo, you can do j5C 5B 5C anima. If you input anima too fast, it will be purple. You have to give just a slight delay after 5C, input anima and it will become green. Anima will catch them like right after they come out of the hit stun from 5c and become green. Best of all. They are too far to DP you, assuming they are mashing it, so it's safe. During the [j5C 5B 5C 6D]xN combo, you can do j5C 5B 6B anima vivace A vivace A. During the [j5C 5B 5C 6D]xN combo most people are usually holding back(4) or down-back(1) just incase you mess up so they can block. So when you vivace A after 6B, they'll walk right into anima, mean while you're already almost back in the same spot you were in with the second vivace just in time to counter hit if they tech the throw, or if they dont you just vivace B and do what ever. On a side note Some times I do j5C 5B 6B anima, vivace A If they tech, right after teching I IAD j5C 2A/5A/5b IAD j2C allecan -> combo. lol We need to have a reset thread. Ever since I stopped throw looping I've come up with some nice resets that I would like to share with you gais . Note, the vivace A one doesn't work on tager. Even if you use vivace B he can still grab you, even though you're literally in the other side and it's CNO. If you want to test it out in CT/CS don't do it on tager. 623C Forces standing CH6B Combo CH6A IAD Combo we need to investigate "Burst Safe" combo choices, b/c this shit is ridiculous. Carl VS Arakune: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkSDPIFVor4 Burst bait with vivace DAMAGE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iw0JcAoLKoo Input trick for volante/Alle~can: j.2C, 421CD, 5C Midscreen Tager 2]D[, 28, 8B+C, Break = Brio Not = volante, land, J.B+C go into UB set #2... Cost much less Ada health. here...negates those 8]D['s Corner low air throw break~cantata set-up CHaracters you can't jump loop- you 6]D[. J.2C, J.C... LOL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNCwi4iUzts&NR=1 Fermata Air unblockable? FCH stuff: http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=AutonomousR#p/u/42/RbJN8OYVdSw The proration depends on your combo and the hits in it unfortunately =( Since it seems like a lot of you dont have this data... Move -> Same move proration 6D -> 70% 2D -> 80% 3D -> 85% 4D -> 80% 8D -> 85% I'm not exactly sure how it works tho, I'm guessing its like if you do 3 6Ds in 1 combo, then your 6Ds do 100%,70%,49% of its damage after all the other proration is handled. Wouldnt make much sense for it to do 100%, 70%, 70% after all. I'm guessing it stacks because if I do bang's 623B (30% same move proration) like 4 times, the last one does like 10 damage 2]D[ can deactivate neesan
Marionette Pwii Posted June 26, 2010 Posted June 26, 2010 lord jesus thats a lot to learn DX for some reason I can't help but think those counter thingies are a bit unsafe. ;-; reason: well usually when you burst it's like this,you're either nearly dead or just in a plain hurry to get a ko off your opponent and Nirvana is usually almost at her limit of dying.so bursting,good or bad idea?I dunno I just though I'd share that
feri Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 CNO Aerial 623d CH > 66/iad j.2c~b > (6b > j.b > j.c > 8d) x 2 > 421d > vivace a for oki
Adelheid Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 What is the situation you are trying for here? I can test this all pretty easily, but I need to make sure I know the situation, because otherwise this isn't going to always be 100% accurate because of course hitstun imparted is not just a measure of a move's level and how many hits are already in the combo, but of a move's level and how many of what hits are already in the combo. So different situations are going to mean different amounts here; 5A > 5B won't even hit 7 hits going on 8 off of 2A 5A 5B 5C (6D) 2A 5A 5B, but it will off of (6D) jC 5B 5C (6D) jC 5A 5B, for instance. Meanwhile, 5B 5C (41236D) 2A 5A 2A 5A 5B will work, even though that's 13 hits going on 14. Of course, the reason for this is now well-known, but since you didn't mention it: In CS, hitstun/untechable time are modified by the same proration at damage.
Zoogstin Posted June 27, 2010 Posted June 27, 2010 Yo kyle when you post vids could you put the specific times that you want us to look at. I want to know when the event happens in the video. Also, MY GOSH THIS IS GHETTO!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHrZXAA0Umc#t=2m23s
Kyle Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 Will do Zoogs. It's still a WIP and I will make sure to time stamp when I'm finishing er up.
Zoogstin Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 It.... it counters throw attempts?? I always knew it countered throws but its just annoying that.... well... it counters throws. Especially Nirvana's. Will do Zoogs. It's still a WIP and I will make sure to time stamp when I'm finishing er up. thanks
soujiro seta Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 It.... it counters throw attempts?? Lol, it counters everything Projectiles (volante, Lambda D-spam, Jin's sword, lobelia, etc), throws, Distortion drives, and other astral finishes. Lol, once anything touches it, it will activate.
ZONG_one Posted June 28, 2010 Posted June 28, 2010 I thought it doenst counter projectiles This. I'm pretty sure it doesn't. I've heard conflicting stories, but I never shoot volante at Hakumen with 8 magatama.
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