[CPEX] Hakumen Gameplay Discussion

[BladeOfJustice7]

Go play some games or enjoy a nice walk outside without your phones, guys.

He's really good in both, awesome.

NIGGA IT'S COLD OUTSIDE.

It everyone has florida weather at this time of the year.

Pffhhah.

This.

[Surf]

>Florida

[toanenadiz]

NIGGA IT'S COLD OUTSIDE.

It everyone has florida weather at this time of the year.

It isn't like he told you go outside naked. Grab a coat and enjoy a brisk walk.

[SansProtocol]

Pffhhah.

Hey, a man can dream.

It isn't like he told you go outside naked. Grab a coat and enjoy a brisk walk.

He gets it.

[psycofang2]

some random hits, some parries, some hit confirms yield less reward but just because it's less than in CSE, does that mean it's less than on average across the whole cast?

he got tools that were buffed that aren't tsubaki hotaru OD in the corner (tsubaki hotaru OD midscreen does high damage as well...) 3c CHs yield very high rewards now and midscreen throws yield higher rewards than before as well. isn't it average for most characters to not get great rewards off everything? it's the best characters that have high rewards in nearly all situations.

and even then, the rewards he gets when he does get rewarded tend to be a lot higher than other members of the cast

those are higher end moves. i was only talking about the combo routes of 2A, 2B, 5A and the like.

never said he was weaker but you'd have to be blind to see his damage isn't equal in all areas like in ex.

he gets below average off those starters and super crazy damage for the others, like ch 3C, 6C, 5C give stupid amounts of damage.

i dont like that, ill get over it of course but it makes it seem like theres more pressure on catching the enemy with the right moves and not just a move in general.

mid screen tsubaki alone hits for 3k if i recall. tsbu hotaru mid screen gives 5k+ without OD.

3C>2C gives 3-4k. 3C combo can allow zantetsu somewhere. he has alot of damage off certain starters, just lowered damage on others. its sporadic.

He gets it.

ive already been outside, repeatedly in the damn ohio cold for about 3-4 hours in total.

im done with the damn outside mang.

EDIT: now i have to go get milk, ah hatchu sanz

Edited March 21, 2013 by psycofang2

[Errol]

No chars get really high reward off starters like 2a anymore. You're saying he gets worse damage than others characters off 2a and stuff? Or is that just because people aren't spending stars.

[psycofang2]

No chars get really high reward off starters like 2a anymore. You're saying he gets worse damage than others characters off 2a and stuff? Or is that just because people aren't spending stars.

its because they arent spending stars like candy anymore which means either they just havent found a better route minus 2AAA 3C for 2k, or theres no better option.

basically lets say it this way since no one gets it, in CSEX the golden scale was pretty even, now its tipped towards emphasis on heavier blows.

not a real problem mind you, its a preference thing and i just dont like it.

DO I NEED TO EXPLAIN ANYTHING ELSE SANZ??????

[Errol]

basically lets say it this way since no one gets it, in CSEX the golden scale was pretty even, now its tipped towards emphasis on heavier blows.

I'm saying that's a system change and not a weakness of Hakumen

[psycofang2]

I'm saying that's a system change and not a weakness of Hakumen

i just said it was a preference.

like right under that.

Edit: play with me errol since you are here anyway.

[Errol]

i just said it was a preference.

like right under that.

Edit: play with me errol since you are here anyway.

i have a prior engagement with toan but if he's busy now I'll play you

[psycofang2]

i hate you both.

send me an invite that way ill know...

that im just a rebound... ;~;

[Dreize]

It sounds to me like you're advocating theory over results. Players playing characters is meaningful when you have standout players, like Goro or Konan. But when a character like Tao, or Valk, has 10 players that are on the level of the standouts from other characters... combined with the fact that Valk is one of the least played characters...? I think theory should then start trying to explain the results. Like how Hak players are here trying to understand why Hak is still S despite feeling weaker than EX, right?

I most certainly am. The reason being? Tournament results entail grey area's that cannot possibly be accounted for in full. Also, I'm not exactly sure about who these "10 Valkenhayn players" are who are supposedly on standout levels comparable to other standout players (my god, does it get any more subjective then this?).

Explain the results you say? I can contrive plenty of possible explanations, however I can't in any way confirm that these reasons are in-fact genuine (if anything it just helps confirm my beliefs regarding grey area's and such). For instance, perhaps the reason that Valkenhayn players win more often then they should is because of the aforementioned fact that the population of Valkenhayn users is so little, thus match-up experience is scarce. Or, perhaps Valkenhayn players truly are a skilled bunch and because the popularity of the character isn't all that high only a select few dedicated players choose to main him and thus a good amount of tournament Valkenhayn players happen to be strong. Shit, maybe most of the time that high-level Valkenhayn players go out to play their opponent is coincidentally having an "off day" and aren't playing like they normally would. Maybe a lot of players happen to be intimidated by wolf mode and a result make terrible decisions that get them killed.

I can think of plenty of reasons as to why Valkenhayn players seemingly do well at tournaments. Some reasons being more plausible then others, of course. All of them being completely fabricated, as well.

I subscribe to theory fighting when tiering character's because even though it is flawed in some area's, it is much more absolute and much more logical. Branding Valkenhayn as an S tier character based solely off of Japanese tournament results is utterly absurd.

I've never quite understood the mindset of someone who chooses to base a character's usefulness off of tournament matches whether it be related to BlazBlue or any other fighting game. Just seems illogical and silly.

But perhaps that's just me, eh?

[psycofang2]

i wouldnt go too deep if i were you.

most people base their findings off tournament results or how much damage a character does.

its somewhat decentish way of placing a character but it has so many subjective variables thats its tough to actually guage properly.

which is why id just ignore it completely.

[BlackYakuzu94]

Definitive Tier lists don't show till console release correct?

[C0R]

Define definitive.

All tier lists are subjective.

[BlackYakuzu94]

Let me rephrase that; More accurate.

[SansProtocol]

ive already been outside, repeatedly in the damn ohio cold for about 3-4 hours in total.

im done with the damn outside mang.

EDIT: now i have to go get milk, ah hatchu sanz

DO I NEED TO EXPLAIN ANYTHING ELSE SANZ??????

You're the one living in Ohio, not me. Learned my lesson a while ago on that lol.

which is why id just ignore it completely.

Sage advice.

[Sophisticat]

*Checks Florida temps*

Fucking 25c over there, fuck you Sans.

We've had two snowstorms this week for an extra foot+ of snow and -10c temps. I want to ride my motorcycle already. ;_;

[Errol]

Subjective and tier lists go hand in hand. Past the early life of BBCP, people on jbbs mostly stopped making and discussing them. The only thing that still carries any weight over there as far as I can tell, is:

1. Famous people lists. These keep getting posted. R1, Tetsuwo, Konan.

2. Stats. Recently I've seen numbers of qualifiers for ArcRevo, and then people keep assembling lists based on dan rankings.

Here is one. Fluctuations are generally pretty low from week to week.

Taokaka 160

Hakumen 156 Valkenhyne 154 Jin 153 Ragna 151 Hazama 151

Litchi 147 Carl 146 Azrael 144 Rachel 141 Noel 140 Tager 140 Bang 140 Mu 140

Platinum 139 Arakune 138 Relius 136 Nu 133 Bullet 133

Tsubaki 128 Izayoi 126 Makoto 125 Amane 123

Average of top 10 players.

Silver tickets for ArcRevo.

8 Taokaka

6 Hakumen

5 Carl

4 Valkenhyne Mu

3 Hazama Ragna Jin Noel

2 Litchi Tager Bang Platinum Azrael

1 Makoto Tsubaki Izayoi Nu Rachel

0 Relius Bullet Amane

Now, this isn't really subjective. But it's something else to say that this all lines up directly to the mythical 'true' tier list. How you interpret it certainly is subjective.

[psycofang2]

see our winter wouldnt be so bad if we didnt have these low temperatures + freezing wind storms all day long

[mAc Chaos]

You better get used to it since Haku is going to be camping the snow stage all day in CP.

[psycofang2]

id rather have a still winter than a windy cold day.

also what the hell is he even doing there anyway?

[Sophisticat]

We've had it at -40c this winter. I normally don't even care about -20c, but -40c makes me want to flip tables.

[psycofang2]

We've had it at -40c this winter. I normally don't even care about -20c, but -40c makes me want to flip tables.

tear a lion in half, drink the honey that comes out.

dont tell your parents son.

[SansProtocol]

*Checks Florida temps*

Fucking 25c over there, fuck you Sans.

We've had two snowstorms this week for an extra foot+ of snow and -10c temps. I want to ride my motorcycle already. ;_;

*GillSF3Laugh.gif* But really, that sucks.

also what the hell is he even doing there anyway?

He works part-time as a windshield ice scrapper.