BBCS2 FINAL SHOWDOWN: Loketest 5, Nov. 15th Discussion

[HiagoX]

The IB change is just the best change of this game. Makoto appreciates it.

[zaeris]

The IB change just made this game better.

But I don't agree with a lot of character changes

unpunishable act C with lambda on block BD repeat till primer is reduce to 1? of cause then people would try to yomi act C then you spam 5D instead lol,

[Reioumu]

wow what a change. i'm a bit worried that some things might be too strong on block now, but i guess we'll see...

also to everyone who wants this game to be guilty gear... why wait? go play guilty gear! might as well hope that SF4 arcade edition plays like 3S or CVS2.

There is a lot of truth here... Minus 3S.

[Andarel]

Considering how easy it is to stuff Act C, I don't see that happening very often.

[LunaKage]

unpunishable act C with lambda on block BD repeat till primer is reduce to 1? of cause then people would try to yomi act C then you spam 5D instead lol,

On IB, Cav is still gonna be -7, so it's still punishable.

[Reioumu]

Also IB still grants meter, so you can still do dead angles.

The IB nerf probably is an incentive to use more dead angles

[Tofu Warrior]

edit: for the record that makes IBing A sledge -5, making it basically UNPUNISHABLE.

And that means even if they IB and try to press a button, 360+A's invincibility will still be active and you can punish them.

Amazing change...but A-Sledge should still be +1. :razz:

[zaeris]

Considering how easy it is to stuff Act C, I don't see that happening very often.

nope but at least you can use it more moderately beside in most case people block too much or jump due to 5d 214d block strings, its about conditioning and reading your opponent. But for now just Act C is unpunishable on block, whether you try to yomi instead that is different which doesn't mean its punishable if people predict, since if you predict sledge you can do the same thing and mash normal CH into CH combo.

[Skye]

On IB, Cav is still gonna be -7, so it's still punishable.

It's still punishable, only with a 7f move or faster, that's everyone's 5a, a fubuki, 360b, a few DDs, etc.

Now Zwei Blade is what worries me, that move was unpunishable on IB in CS1 and when used in a blockstring was only stuff-able with a 1f invincibility reversal.

[Spirit Juice]

Inversely, IB nerf means Tager's defensive options are worse.

[AdamNW]

Will the IB change be noticeable for scrubs? <_< I never really learned how to punish on IB.

[LunaKage]

It's still punishable, only with a 7f move or faster, that's everyone's 5a, a fubuki, 360b, a few DDs, etc.

Now Zwei Blade is what worries me, that move was unpunishable on IB in CS1 and when used in a blockstring was only stuff-able with a 1f invincibility reversal.

Right, but Blade could only combo in the corner, and that was tough unless you were close, Easy to combo in the corner on CH though, midscreen it could only combo with a rapid cancel, and that may not be possible anymore if 5D has more startup(I think I remember seeing that change in one loketest).

[Skye]

Considering stunedge's translations towards the direction they want to take Lambda, Zwei Blade will do all it needs to do by launching you to the end of the screen.

[zaeris]

On IB, Cav is still gonna be -7, so it's still punishable.

That is right, I remember that it is -5 forgetting to add frame advantage.

ACt B was punishable by bang and people with 5 frame attack on Ib e.g. hazama 5a, rachel 5a.

Edited November 18, 2010 by zaeris

[Henaki]

Inversely, IB nerf means Tager's defensive options are worse.

the charge buff helps a lot for defensive options (assuming he has meter and he can just IB without punishing for that). on top of this unlike a lot of characters he doesnt need as many frames for IB -> punish in a string (3 for 360a, 1 for 720) unlike say bang or staffless litchi.

imo he hurts less than MOST characters for the IB nerf. though any character with a real dp is obviously better off than him.

[LunaKage]

That is right, I remember that it is -5 forgetting to add frame advantage.

ACt B was punishable by bang and people with 5 frame attack on Ib e.g. hazama 5a.

-4 bro. just one frame away from being punishable on normal block.

[smooshman]

oh cool, so even if 2D's IB'd we're still at +, 236A/dash cancels are less risky.

[zaeris]

-4 bro. just one frame away from being punishable on normal block.

how did you come up with -4 when act B is 0 on block? since IB is -5.

EDIt, lol, im not thinking. since your talking about act C,

Edited November 18, 2010 by zaeris

[currentlemon]

So for the IB nerf, does it make Rachel's 2c worse or better?

[Synthesis]

Rachel 2C was always trash. =/ IB buffered backdash 4D was the best option she had out of IB.

[Skye]

Rachel's 2c sucks because it guard points instead of invincibility. Not that I'm saying it should have invincibility.

[Gorehound]

Inversely, IB nerf means Tager's defensive options are worse.

So that means no random 360/720 during a block string, GOOD!!

Tager players should still be happy that he still got all them buffs.

[huey253]

iB nerf, NOOOOOOOO

hopefully they change the frame data quite a bit from cs1, it seems like characters like valkenhayn/bang could bullshit you for a long time.

[Ronove]

iB nerf, NOOOOOOOO

hopefully they change the frame data quite a bit from cs1, it seems like characters like valkenhayn/bang could bullshit you for a long time.

Heh, I don't about that... he shouldn't be able to reset safely his pressure anymore with the changes they've made to his wolf cancel (even if IB got nerfed), so basically if his pokes get blocked his pressure just ends there and he simply has to "retaliate" rather than keeping up the pressure in wolf form as he's currently able to do. He's going to rely a damn lot on footsies now, imo.

[A.X.I.S.]

So that means no random 360/720 during a block string, GOOD!!

Tager players should still be happy that he still got all them buffs.

Nah we still can 720 you, just not as many 360's.