[P4A] Naoto Shirogane - Gameplay Discussion "Ace Detective"

[Kyle]

I made this up for a community combo video. After the reset, I could have gone into 214D, 236A~D SMP w/ 0-resources. But chose not to. Enjoy

[Rikir]

I made this up for a community combo video. After the reset, I could have gone into 214D, 236A~D SMP w/ 0-resources. But chose not to. Enjoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6deJtkBmEU

That was way cool :O

[OmniSScythe]

Since I probably won't ever have the time to make a detailed video on this:

It's kinda old at this point. =/

[xntrikcat]

Is there a low resource smp loop from a airgrab > d megido starter?

[Ichipoo]

Is there a low resource smp loop from a airgrab > d megido starter?

[Kyle]

50, unless they are in fear.

JC+D, (D-trap hits), 2[C], C, IAD, J.B, J.C, Land, 66C, 214A~CCCCC, Mudoon, 214C, AA, (C-trap hits), C, (236B~D)x10, 236A~D.

@Omni: What I LIKE about this: it's Burst safe. Most people burst the follow-up to the throw. I've been doing other super to silence them... Will try it w/ this super. I am sure there is more DMG potential before the reset. possibly

C+D~C, 236236B, 66, B, C, IAD, J.B, J.C, 66C, 236B, 66C, IAD, J.A, J.C, 66C, 214D.

Edited October 12, 2012 by Kyle

[Ichipoo]

Naoto's should mash j.A more...... just sayin'

[Gravelneed]

Been trying to make more of a use for Hamaon. Many times has it match point for me and the opponent has 8 or less on Fate Gauge, so when I catch them in a throw in the corner, I sometimes do CD~C, 236236B, 66, 5B, 5C, 236B, 236A, Hamaon. Then go for some sorta quick mixup. Unfortunately, several characters have a useful R-Action to escape the situation even though Hamaon looks very meaty. I might still get tagged by Getsu-Ei or Big Gamble when trying for a mixup. Most people online are too scared to even try an R-Action/Super, but some have and I've paid the price for it. Is there a better use for this super or should I just not really bother with it.

[Zeromus_X]

jA da gawd, also I would only use Hamaon if I have 100-150 meter and really need the kill. It is really meaty, but only after the huge startup where characters can just roll or DP through it. Also you don't really get anything off of it so better opponents will just let themselves get hit for 1.5k rather than let you mix them up. Now if they have 0 skulls, it's a different story entirely.

[Kyle]

http://www.twitch.tv/pandaxgaming/b/335479658

0:33:00 Kyle Naoto vs Ivysaur Chie

4:50:00 Kyle Naoto vs Uri Slabs

[Ichipoo]

It's probably because we're not gdlk like the Japanese Naotos but is there anything we can do against Chie and SLab?

[Elochai]

Halp, all I do is mash j.C and 5A > 5B > 2C. What are some good blockstrings that I can do? Learning new characters is always so fun .

[Ichipoo]

-5A/2A/5A, 5AA staggers and what not.

-End your initial blockstrings with sweep in order to condition them.

-Grab and use AoAs. No seriously, mix in a few grabs and overheads if you want opponents to respect Naoto since her pressure is rather one dimensional compared to others.

-Performing 5C before 5B to mess with your opponent's rhythm.

-Running up to my opponent after a few 5A/2As to make it look like I'm about to grab them and then backdash away to mess with them.

-Mix in a few 2[C]s if they're being REALLY respectful for some odd reason since it's +8 on block.

This is just what I do. I'm sure there's some really good tricks out there that I haven't mentioned.

[Zeromus_X]

2[C] is really good as long as you don't get predictable. I like to use it at not quite throw distance to mix it up with tick throws, that way if they think I'll grab they won't throw me out of the startup, but I still have enough frame advantage to dash 5A/2A if they block it. You can also link 5C afterwards to catch jump outs for an IAD bnb.

IAD air turn or forward jump air turn > crossup jC is good. IAD air turn jB can also be used for a faster overhead.

Pay attention to where traps are on the screen. If your pressure strings will push them into traps, you can use the added blockstun to make some things that are questionable to pressure with (like 236A~D) into legit blockstrings, or simply to extend your normal pressure.

Jump in jC > jump cancel > j214D to bait anti-airs or jC again. jC isn't an overhead, but the jump cancel on block can be useful.

2B can be good to mixup blockstrings if you're really close (near 5A/2A range), mostly because people will go WTF when you actually use this move, and it's jump-cancellable on block.

Superjump 214D > airdash airturn - trap crossup.

Jump/IAD jAA > j214C > land > throw or 5A/2A. Can do Ky-style tick throws after an air trap as it explodes.

Jump/IAD jAA > j214D > land A+C. Roll for a trap crossup.

Vs only: jump up jAAAA...for an easy fuzzy guard. Can also do after a blocked jump in jC.

Naoto's pressure isn't bad, but you do have to mix it up a lot and condition the opponent a bit.

What's also important is knowing how to use traps for oki. Naoto doesn't have setups that can cover multiple options like Yu, Shlabrys, or other crazy oki characters, but her reward for hitting with a trap is huge so if you can read the opponent a bit they'll usually be scared enough to block the trap.

i.e. whatever into 236A~D > 214D

-Throws are really good to use after a trap. Throwing beats rolls and mashing, and you can throw them right after setting the trap and before it explodes. If they break the throw though, you lose all traps you have set and any momentum you had.

-Jumping will bait reversals and allow you to continue pressure once the trap explodes, but loses to rolls.

-Meaty attacks like 5A or 2A will allow you to continue pressure right after the trap is set, but if they just get hit you have to use specific hitconfirms to really capitalize.

Instead of 214D, you can also use 214C because of it's faster recovery. You can't do throws directly after it on their wakeup, but you can jump earlier to bait stuff or continue pressure as it explodes. You can also forgoe setting a trap immediately, and try an airturn crossup trap if they're really conditioned.

[Random Naoto]

I was messing around in training mode and figured out if you do 5D and then raid, you can hit the second 5D at any time and the persona will come out during the animation and even during the super freeze for critical shot. I haven't figured out any real gimmicks or anything, but it locks them down long enough that you can basically throw out raid/crit shot for free, or delay the second 5D for when they try to punish it.

[Ichipoo]

I think my Naoto has hit a plateau. I feel like she's not improving no matter how many times I get bodied.

[MikeySupreme]

grind the fuck out of each match up one at a time.

[Ichipoo]

If only I had the time though, being a college student really doesn't allow you to have much time for video games anymore. I guess I'll just stick to what I do best, sticking to fundamentals, playing to my character's strengths but be derp and braindead when under pressure/defense.

[Kyle]

I have recorded all of my saved replays. Will make a "highlights" video showing comebacks, getting owned & other gimmicks in the upcoming days. Looking forward to it.

UPDATE:

27 mins total, I've got a few matches, highlights, burst stuff, combos and me getting bodied.

Edited October 30, 2012 by Kyle

[Kyle]

Persona 4 Arena: XBL KyleW Naoto

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7HmMP5ujeiY

Video created w/ Youtube video editor b/c my file formats were obscure. Audio is pretty low. just open another window and play somethin.

Hope everyone enjoys

Will place in video thread later.

[MikeySupreme]

Ryoji Ikeda?

[Ichipoo]

Just out of curiosity, but does Naoto have ANY good matchups?

[Zeromus_X]

I think Elizabeth is pretty good for Naoto, but having a good matchup against Liz isn't saying much. Kanji is supposedly a good matchup but he only needs one lucky guess to ruin Naoto's day. Other than that...yeah, every other matchup seems bad or annoying at best for Naoto. Hopefully if Arcsys/Atlus ever update this game they buff her traps and give her an actual anti-air and damaging combos that aren't SMP loops. Better trap oki that could cover more options would be nice too.

Edited November 18, 2012 by Zeromus_X

[Xtra_Zero]

Alright, so I'm a bit late to the party, but I've been playing Naoto in arcades since August. Picked up the console version last week. I'm running into two major issues:

1) Oki/pressure. How the hell do I keep my opponent sweating? I can get knockdowns okay, but once they're down (especially midscreen) I feel like all they have to do is hold 7 to get out for free.

2) Mixups. Most of my melee hits come from sweeps, furious action, and random air-to-air j.C CHs, which don't convert into big damage very well it seems. I've experimented with shorthop, but I can't seem to make it worth using. I can't get hop A, B, or C to convert into a ground combo like I can off a regular jump.

Edited December 5, 2012 by Xtra_Zero

[Tong]

For Oki off knockdown 236A, I usually go for dash 214D -> 2A, provided they're conditioned enough to block. If you knockdown using Sweep, chain into 5DD and for the mixup.

But unfortunely, Naoto is far from being good on Oki/Pressure as Chie and Yu are. So you're going to be creative about this...

Whenever my stuff gets blocked, I usually JC on 5C and either airdash ou superjump while setting up a D Trap midair, depending on how my opponent behaves. It's pretty safe unless they see it coming.

And yes, Naoto midscreen confirms are horrible, earns very little damage and almost no Oki on most cases... If you want decent Oki midscreen some damage will be sacrified. This is the basic midscreen combo off Trap confirms:

214C/D 2[C] 5C IAD j.A j.C 5C 236A~D -> Oki

Not sure if it's better to replace 236A with 236B~D, since the opponent might airtech before you're able to setup something.

I'm not very experienced also, so I hope someone clear all this up lol