BBCP Story Thread [Old]

[Iron Maw]

Oh so you know the quote which I spoke of then. Lol then it's quite an ironic circumstance if so. Worth a shot I suppose. Still, been playing through Calamity Trigger a lot lately and was pleasantly surprised at a lot of the foreshadowing. Gives me confidence that Mori actually had this plot thought out and wasn't just pulling it out of his ass as he went along. Refreshing all things considering. As a rule, I tend to despise sequelized story-telling. This is about the only game I'll break my one rule on that.

Foreshadowing has never been an issue with BB. Even the whole Murakumo-Izayoi connection was mentioned in CS (rather off-handedly though). BB's problem has more to do with it's obtuse and cryptic nature on how it dolls out information. This made worse by the all the cross-media sidestuff like the Phase Shift novels which introduce plot-elements (like Kushinda's Lynchpin) that will play a rather big role in later games despite not being mentioned in the games themselves prior. The writing has a pretty bad habit of treating in-universe terms and the like as things you should already know.

Edited January 15, 2013 by Iron Maw

[Ehecatl]

Foreshadowing has never been an issue with BB. Even the whole Murakumo-Izayoi connection was mentioned in CS (rather off-handedly though). BB's problem has more to do with it's obtuse and cryptic nature on how it dolls out information. This made worse by the all the cross-media sidestuff like the Phase Shift novels which introduce plot-elements (like Kushinda's Lynchpin) that will play a rather big role in later games despite not being mentioned in the games themselves prior. The writing has a pretty bad habit of treating in-universe terms and the like as things you should already know.

Kushinada's Lynchpin is mentioned in CS, or at least CS Extend. As for the cross-media stuff, I'm pretty sure Chrono-Phantasma will retell all of what we've read in the books for the sake of making the plot easier for everyone to follow, so I'm not really concerned about that. I see the books as really just a sneak peak in what the games will end up telling us anyway. Oh but rest assured, if they DON'T, I'll be right there bitchin' and leaking butthurt-ness all over the place. That would just be poor story-telling after all.

And no I won't disagree with you there. The story is very much structured in a way to where you HAVE to play the next game to understand the plot of the last. It's quite a cobbled-together plot that loves to just throw words and phrases at you and then says "if you want to even remotely understand what we're talking about, wait until the NEXT installment". I mean, I wouldn't mind it if the story was all self-contained and would have no problem with it being cryptic and obtuse if by the end, it pieced it all together and we all could go "Oh my god! It finally makes sense! *mindgasm explosion*". But that doesn't happen and we're left scratching our heads until they release another sequel which we have to pay for lol. As a rule, I abhor this method of story-telling as well as any story that relies on a sequel to make it's plot work. And, while it's an excellent business strategy to retain interest and profit, it's a terrible way to tell a plot.

I mean, the video game industry is a volatile market to attempt this kind of writing in, probably more so than even the movie and book industry. It's incredibly presumptuous to assume you'll have the success, money, time, and stability to tell a video game story across a 3-6 year period spanning 3-4 installments. From a writing perspective, if that business fails, changes management, losses money, is pressing you for time, etc. it will affect the quality of the writing or even end it all together. And that's assuming your story is actually worth the time when its all said and done anyway. We can reach the end of this plot and think to ourselves "lolwut... That's it?" And with any story like Blazblue where every installment is reliant on all the others, a single link in the chain falling apart is all it takes for the whole thing to become crap. So yes, I generally on principle despise this means of story-telling. Were it not also a good fighting game (and thus still fun even if the story ends up garbage), I probably wouldn't even spend my money.

[Anfingrimm]

Man, I feel sorry for the translators and actors who have to sub and dub all this without knowing what the fuck is going on half the time.

[LadyRequiem]

Hmmm... I can't believe I read through this entire thread. Very....informative?

Not sure if that's the word

Anyway... This might not have much to do with CP but its been bugging me for a while.

In Noel's story mode in CS/CSEX right after Hazama/Terumi shows her I think of people suffering or something like that? (Wasn't too sure about this scene) he says afterward

"Guess seeing something like that for 100 years can really mess you up" (or something along those lines)

I know that not much about Hazama/Terumi has been revealed but since Noel was able to see a bit of Carl's past when she met up with him before, was that scene she witnessed from Hazama something from his past?

I could be wrong about this as it's been a while since I've played through the story modes. But if someone can enlighten me on this that'd be great.

But I do hope CP will give a bit more details about the best character in the whole game (IMO of course :D)when it comes out for consoles

[Rishtopher]

BB's problem has more to do with it's obtuse and cryptic nature on how it dolls out information. This made worse by the all the cross-media sidestuff like the Phase Shift

Kingdom Hearts has the same problem (segmentation) but it's my favourite franchise, followed by BB; which is probably why I put up with its BS so easily lol. I suspect that most of the stuff covered in the novels will make it into the games at some point (albeit, a bit watered down) so I'm not too worried. The lynchpin was mentioned by Relius in CS iirc? My gripe with BB is that there only seems to be one person at a time who knows what's going on and they only have a bit to say before they get cut off and we have to wait til the next game.

That said, I'm glad it's Relius because he's currently my favourite character and he seems to be at the center of the story in CP.

[Surf]

After watching some of that CT stuff i realized. Ragna must be pretty damn ignorant, if he doesnt even know who Hakumen is. One of the Six Heroes. He even said his name. Then agaim Ragna is the definition of an ignorant fool

And damn the animation quality of CT was so freaking bad. The voice acting seems worse too

[mAc Chaos]

Well, it's been like 100 years since the guy was supposed to be alive. Imagine if someone showed up today claiming they were Abe Lincoln.

[Tong]

If anything, CT animations were better than CS's.

[Surf]

I mean animations as in the animation cutscenes. Like when Ragna activates his grimoire.

Well, it's been like 100 years since the guy was supposed to be alive. Imagine if someone showed up today claiming they were Abe Lincoln.

I guess so. Doesn't change the fact he's a dumbass

[BlackYakuzu94]

A fighting game protagonist who's an idiot, who would have thought...

Honestly, I think Ragna knows Hakumen is one of the Six Heroes, he just doesn't give a shit; I mean he talks shit to Valkenhayn and Hazama too so I hardly wouldn't put it past him to not care about crap like that. It fits considering his personality.

[Putin]

I mean animations as in the animation cutscenes. Like when Ragna activates his grimoire.

They were well drawn and fluid, what's wrong with them lol

CS cutscenes on the other hand... some of the most horrid animation attempts I've ever seen.

CP cutscenes Mori pls

[Chaoschao222]

Well, it's been like 100 years since the guy was supposed to be alive. Imagine if someone showed up today claiming they were Abe Lincoln.

No one else seems to have this issue though, everybody else is all like "YO HOLY SHIT, HAKUMEN-SAMA!? OF THE 6 HEROES!? YO ULLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!" or soemthin'.

[mAc Chaos]

Bang has the most sensible reaction hilariously enough. Just assumes it's some guy running around in a suit.

[Surf]

They were well drawn and fluid, what's wrong with them lol

They looked dull, grey, and awkward imo. Their not bad, just weird looking. Funny enough, Iconoclast is still my favorite opening. Anyone else notoce how serious CTs opening is compared to the other ones. Extend opening makes me throw up. Please let CP be good.

But yea, this series has come a long way. I still remember seeing Hakumen for the first time. Was gdlk then and its still gdlk seeing that scene now.

[Ctrlaltwtf]

CT opening was da bess. The attitude/style of the opening is so much better...

You must be confused because CT's animation quality was significantly better than CS lol.

[Ryudrake]

There's only one scene in CT that I thought looked funny and that was the scene where Ragna enters the NOL branch and fights Jin. Their faces just looked weird imo.

[LionHeartx]

There's only one scene in CT that I thought looked funny and that was the scene where Ragna enters the NOL branch and fights Jin. Their faces just looked weird imo.

Yeah Jin's face after him and Ragna clash reminds me of a pedophile. Which oddly fits him...

[BlackYakuzu94]

CT opening was da bess. The attitude/style of the opening is so much better...

You must be confused because CT's animation quality was significantly better than CS lol.

Are talking openings, or in-game scenes because if the latter than yea, CT by a long shot.

[Chaoschao222]

Are talking openings, or in-game scenes because if the latter than yea, CT by a long shot.

... But CS' opening was just a bunch of stills.... and CT's was God-tier...

[Ehecatl]

... But CS' opening was just a bunch of stills.... and CT's was God-tier...

Holy shit yeah it was. Some beautiful animation work in CT. In CS, I was asking myself "What happened?". The reconstruction also had a great intro animation scene when those scientists tried to temper Noel and got roasted from orbit.

As for Ragna, I wouldn't say he's an idiot... He's about like an average Joe save for a few facepalm moments. His main flaw is that he's a quiter and tends to take everything for granted-- which when you consider that the world is at stake, would make him an idiot, heheh.

[Alpha to Omega]

His main flaw is that he's a quiter and tends to take everything for granted-- which when you consider that the world is at stake, would make him an idiot, heheh.

How is Ragna a quitter? He's pretty much the exact opposite.

[Surf]

You must be confused because CT's animation quality was significantly better than CS lol.

Im not confused about anything. I just dont like the way the animation looked in CT. But I digress, this isnt the thread to talk about that really.

My problem with Ragna is mainly his piece of shit attitude. His design is fairly decent except for the random ass out of place japanese pants. Just his attitude. Foul mouth moron who doesnt take the time to consider the little things before he goes charging into something. Characters like that are the bane of my existence. Granted its somewhat not his fault that hes ignorant because no one ever tells him things in clear cut ways for his little mind to process. If he was a side character

or Litchi

id be like ok, ill just ignore this douche. But hes the main character, so he cant really be avoided. Its really sad most of his story is always composed of the more mature experienced characters telling him how retarded he is.

[Tong]

It's like your childhood got suddenly fucked up by some random monster.

Having the most powerful Grimoire+being trained by the most powerful being in earth, yes, may make you kinda confident if not arrogant.

[Ehecatl]

How is Ragna a quitter? He's pretty much the exact opposite.

Yeah after FAILING time and again for 724 phases because he takes his life for granted and gives up when the going gets tough! Perhaps I wasn't clear or you completely failed to understand the point of his character development not to mention the theme of the whole series?

He's a loser. He bitches about everything. Sometimes for good reason; I mean, he's got to deal with the worst bullshit. But he has a tendency to forget what he's fighting for, and when he does-- he fails. Why do you think Jubei and Rachel harrass the living hell out of him? Hell even as a kid, Jubei. Had to beat the ever-loving shit out of him because he kept talking about how he can't do this or that. Jubei had to run him hard to whip him into shape. And Rachel spent many a timeline bitching him out for not allowing himself to realize his full potential.

His whole development is about him learning to never accept defeat or allow others to control him. It's about him fighting for himself and refusing to give in to his impulse to take the easy way out. He's a badass and I personally find it inspiring considering it's a lesson I have to relearn time and again in my life. And I love his character and can relate to him because of it. But that is his development and his main flaw as a character.

[harmless kitten]

Ragna would probably listen more to others if they actually explained things instead of just going "because I said so."

In Calamity Trigger, he has no reason to believe destroying Nu is going to be any different from the other two times he's killed her. He actually could've interrupted her tempering process if not for Jin and Hakumen, but it's not like that could've been avoided. If Ragna could be diverted from Kagutsuchi, if Hakumen could be delayed, if Nu's tempering could've been interrupted--these things are impossible and would mean changing some of the constants of the time loop. If these constants could be so easily changed, the time loop wouldn't exist in the first place.

In Continuum Shift, all he knows is that Rachel and Kokonoe are telling him not to fight Terumi. In Ragna's mind, this is them telling him that he should twiddle his thumbs while Terumi does god-knows-what with Noel. He doesn't even know why he shouldn't fight Terumi. Ragna's not someone who can take a peek at other possibilities of the continuum shift and see that this was a bad idea. Hell, for all we know there were Ragnas that chose to hold off, but this isn't the possibility that Terumi and co. want, so one of the continuum shifts where he does fight Terumi becomes the dominant one.

In CT, I felt that he had SEVERE anger management issues ("That's when I began to hate everything," his rant to Jubei, and Nu's attempt at sweet talk), but this was dialed down for CS.

What about Ragna is a quitter? He's impulsive, headstrong, mulish, and hates to back down even when it would make things easier for himself. That isn't quitting, that's just...being stubborn.

Edited January 17, 2013 by harmless kitten