[CPEX] Relius Clover Gameplay Discussion

[WakeUpDP]

same thing. If you use the setup that you mentioned a while back, then both are safe jumps regardless if used otherwise like on crouch 5C>6C they can reversal easily whatever you used. Anyways 916zking tried to do the same setups but it gets blown up so easily haha, don't focus too much on UB and get that 214C oki.

I wouldn't use 2D too much against an opponent trying to close in because of the startup. But you should use 2D because of the lockdown it offers and punish people that go too much out of their way to hit Ignis.

But 3C>2D covers you way more than 6D, especially when you do empty jumps 2B to late airdash j.B/j.C.

[NecroTheReaper]

Generally I go for 214C oki if my pad will ever allow 3C after 4D instead of 2C Dx I'm too broke for a good controller.

[916zking]

Anyways 916zking tried to do the same setups but it gets blown up so easily haha, don't focus too much on UB and get that 214C oki..

I trade of between the two of them. So far for me it seems to be working fine. And now that 236D had some properties changed if they forward roll out of the corner it keeps them locked on the ground for a bit. But 214C oki is the safest way to go lol

Also, what's the interest for a skype Relius group like? XD

Edited November 12, 2013 by 916zking

[TD]

l didn't forget about you guys. time schedule is tough but im working on the threads in my spare time. im almost finished ragna and the info will probably be posted tonight if im not tired.

in the meantime i'm going to start looking over the info in the matchup threads, correcting/posting info and all of that.

[NecroTheReaper]

Sorry about the lack of organization then TD in the matchup threads, I think a lot of them only cover one part of what people said they had trouble with xD;

Relius skype group I don't mind, don't really use skype alot though since it drains my phone. I think my skype is still necrothereaper lol

[TD]

Info is info. So long as it isn't blatantly wrong, any bits should be ok.

[TD]

Alright so I looked through some of the threads. Great job guys! There looks to be a useful tidbit it a lot of the threads. I sifted through the posts and added them to the OP with credit. If you don't see your name don't fret as this is a huge WIP and there is always a chance to get your opinion heard.

I will continue to look through the threads and such, and also, listed a lot of info on the Ragna matchup for anyone who wants to take a look and start a discussion.

If you guys know any character specialists please ask them to help up create out matchup threads by sharing their knowledge. Also encourage you guys to post in the other character's threads if you know something they don't, kind of like scratching their backs for the same treatment, if you will. I will probably put inverse links int the OP's for easier access sometime in the future.

[NecroTheReaper]

Apologies to anyone who reads advice and doesn't find some of it prctical. Im no good at execution yet, so a lot of it is theory based and/or screwing in training mode xD;

Btw, has anyone done Relius' challenge 30? Not a big deal, but I've gotten other 100% (admittedly both easy DLC challenges) and I wamma get my main done @.@

[TD]

l only use training and network mode, the rest can wait for NA release imo. what is his challenge 30?

[NecroTheReaper]

Use Lugia 8 times in one combo xD

[TD]

lol.

[NecroTheReaper]

I'm just curious cuz it feels so weird to me compared to extend, did his 214x moves and D always put him in CH state? I just don't remember getting CH this much every time I ise ignis

[Elochai]

That existed in Extend as well. Maybe the recovery time is longer in CP or something?

[NecroTheReaper]

I think its mostly the j.xD series that caught me off guard, I didn't really use the move a lot till the end of extend (use it all the time now) and it just felt so different getting CH from using j.xD

[WakeUpDP]

Relius Challenge 30, thanks to Nikki (aka sleon) Edited November 17, 2013 by WakeUpDP

[NecroTheReaper]

So... what do you do to someone who can block our crossup j.2D Dx i was fightin a Jin that could block every mixup I threw at him, which I know Relius' mixup isnt great, but still Dx do I resort to stagger 2A in this situation to get em to mash?

Ps: just noticed crossunder 3C still works after 4D in the corner, doesn't seem like the crossunder 3C>214C mixes up as good anymore, but seems like it could give some interesting options. Like maybe crossunder 3C>meaty 214B>ley for recrossup

Edited November 18, 2013 by NecroTheReaper

[TD]

relius is not a mixup character, and you shouldn't be going for it without either a plan or a guarantee that it will hit. the goal is unrelenting pressure. stagger pressure is almost a must in extended strings; your goal is to trick the opponent into thinking youre unsafe so they can twitch and you out-yomi them. meanwhile, youre budgeting your ignis attacks so that you can have her out for a long time. basically, the optimal scenario is a foe scared to press buttons, has blocked for awhile, and you used a small amount of ignis guage, likely from stagger pressure.

[NecroTheReaper]

Its so annoying when all they do when you have ignis out is just... block though. Its like they know you're safe >.>

[TD]

think about it.

relius safe pressure: (most mid attacks, 2b, 3c) + 6d

mixup: 6a, jb, jc, 2b, 3c

moves that are both safe enough and lead to mixup: all ignis specials

the first point are his fastest attacks. 5b, 6d, his staple neutral moves basically, to start.

if the player realizes the foe is blocking everything, he then stops his safe pressure and goes into his unsafe mixup. overheads can mostly be poked out of and ignis moves have lenghty startups, but the advantage is that the foe is expecting something safe.

the options arent great, they were designed for the creative spirits in each of us.

[NecroTheReaper]

So in other words... I must learn to be a jackass who uses 6C and 236C as legit mixup... interesting. One thing I found from experience is that everyone with a dp likes to dp after 214A. Man, I need to learn to play unsafe on offense. 6C>214A with ignis active is a 3 frame gap isn't it?

[TD]

not exactly what l was suggesting, but l think you got the point.

6c delay 236c is a gimmick but it does the job when you need to recharge ignis as 6c is technically the end of his pressure, and punishable so people will try to mount an offense. it is air UB though so has its use vs chicken blocking.

6c 214a is in the same category. don't forget it, but don't use it much. not sure of the frame gap in cp, haven't got time to read frame data just yet, but its not safe, particularly vs dp characters.

6c delay 236a is the last of them, beats attempt at trying to punish him.

these three together form an rps situation that doesn't give the best reward but sometimes is necessary.

[NecroTheReaper]

I'm just curious, does he have anything he can RC into mixup? Out of all the things I was hoping back when the loke tests were goin on it was that j.C would get a IOH hitbox since he doesn't have a lot of jump cancel opportunities. Does falling j.C>rapid>j.B/C come out before he hits the ground? Generally falling j.C is where people assume its safe to block low again.

[TD]

falling jc rising jc RC falling jc should work, but you should test when you get the chance.

iirc, rising jc is an instant overhead vs hakumen and tager, can combo meterless with ignis

[NecroTheReaper]

Honestly, havnt had a lot of Haks or tager matches lately. Kinda sad since hakumen is the matchup I have the most experience with. I'll test it though, I got off for today because it keeps kicking me after 1 match and no one I know had a lobby. I need to upload some more of my matches as well.

[WakeUpDP]

Or you can do it with falling j.B>jump cancel>j.C>j.2D for a meterless fuzzy guard which is what I'm trying to add in my gameplay.

There is also the classic j.B>6A that is totally be beaten by mashing but they don't expect an unsafe option and go back to crouch blocking.

Late airdash j.B>j.C or empty jump 2B/3C. Mixing how you throw/bait throw with j.2D etc.