[CPEX] Relius Clover Gameplay Discussion

[TD]

Alright then, i'll start them. I'm gonna pm hard bread so he knows. going to use the same old format because it looks good. thinking about adding an "in the air, his tools vs x's tools" section as that is equally important as a good ground game.

Edited October 29, 2013 by TD

[NecroTheReaper]

Indeed, especially since for A to A combat, Rel really needs ignis since his normals, while fast and good air to ground hitbox, don't go very far.

[WakeUpDP]

Alright then, i'll start them. I'm gonna pm hard bread so he knows. going to use the same old format because it looks good. thinking about adding an "in the air, his tools vs x's tools" section as that is equally important as a good ground game.

Thanks TD

Updated a bit the combo section, and for those that are looking for different combo routes/OD stuff. There was the video that Kurushii linked and hard_bread mentionned earlier but it was set to private probably for music issues.

I found on twitter where he reuploaded the video that can be found at the end of the video thread.

[mikeatsgarbage]

matchup threads.

looking forward to that!

does azrael win this matchup? having a lot of trouble here lol

[NecroTheReaper]

I'll give you a short answer of I feel its even or barely in our favor, i had a series of matches against a good Azrael today and it didn't seem too bad, but lets save the discussion for the actual threads

[TD]

l will finish the rest by tomorrow be it day or like after 12am. it shouldn't take too much longer. im getting bodied by a fever, so l can only stay awake for so long.

[NecroTheReaper]

Yeah, I cant beat a good Kagura for shit, really need some help there lol

[TD]

Done.

Kokonoe and anyone else will be added as they are released. Otherwise feel free to discuss the matchups in the corresponding threads.

Also...

Thanks TD

Updated a bit the combo section, and for those that are looking for different combo routes/OD stuff. There was the video that Kurushii linked and hard_bread mentionned earlier but it was set to private probably for music issues.

I found on twitter where he reuploaded the video that can be found at the end of the video thread.

You're welcome and thank you guys for putting several combos in the combo thread. Once hard bread adds everything to the first post, it should start looking good. I appreciate the help guys, I really do.

Now, for the matchup threads. I'm sure some or most of you here are dustloop vets or old enough to read and follow rules. I am not a mod so I cannot enforce anything. However, I do expect a certain level of knowledge and maturity to go into each matchup thread. As a simple rule of thumb, if you reread your post and it sounds stupid, do the math. Anyone who repeatedly posts misinformation or uses the matchup thread as a free-for-all will have to be reported. I most certainly do not want to do that, and I'm sure you guys can handle yourselves, so we should be fine, right?

In the form of any arguments that may break out the same rule applies. Don't let a matchup thread be 3 pages of flaming. Let it be that long because there's a lot of information. If you absolutely must argue take it to pm's, please.

And that's it! Feel free to post any questions, comments and concerns as well as info that I can update the posts with.

[NecroTheReaper]

This is beside the point but still relating to your post, I think most of us Relius players here are pretty cool, so I doubt we'll be starting any flame wars here. Cant say much for newer people though.

[Boodendorf]

Awesome, thanks TD!

Shouldn't the CSE MU threads be in the archives though? Or is it because the game isn't out outside of japan yet so those thread aren't considered archives?

Another question, do we post videos about the matchups in the matchup thread or in the video thread? Like say (this is a complete random example) I demonstrate how to beat Tager's sledge with Ignis on a video, in training mode. Where do I post that?

[NecroTheReaper]

I'd say that's more for the matchup threads since its.character specific and would be easier to find, but I didn't put up the threads so... i guess my input didn't really matter xD

[WakeUpDP]

Awesome, thanks TD!

Shouldn't the CSE MU threads be in the archives though? Or is it because the game isn't out outside of japan yet so those thread aren't considered archives?

Another question, do we post videos about the matchups in the matchup thread or in the video thread? Like say (this is a complete random example) I demonstrate how to beat Tager's sledge with Ignis on a video, in training mode. Where do I post that?

I would assume that only mods can archive threads but it's not a problem atm since they're all on the second page.

And the videos that you mentioned belong to the matchup thread as the video thread are for matches/combo videos. As long as the video is pertinent, you can refer to it in your post..

[NecroTheReaper]

Does anyone else feel like the change to vinum was stupid and uncalled for? I can't get the thing to come out for shit anymore -_- 23663214 is a stupid motion for Rel's only reversal option

[TD]

This is beside the point but still relating to your post, I think most of us Relius players here are pretty cool, so I doubt we'll be starting any flame wars here. Cant say much for newer people though.

My post is really for them. Having observed most of you, and the general popularity of relius, I really don't feel there will be any problems from the old guys. It's always better to let everyone know in case something does go down, so if someone is flagrantly or unknowingly breaking the rules, any of us can kindly tell them.

Awesome, thanks TD!

Shouldn't the CSE MU threads be in the archives though? Or is it because the game isn't out outside of japan yet so those thread aren't considered archives?

Another question, do we post videos about the matchups in the matchup thread or in the video thread? Like say (this is a complete random example) I demonstrate how to beat Tager's sledge with Ignis on a video, in training mode. Where do I post that?

No problem.

Also...

I would assume that only mods can archive threads but it's not a problem atm since they're all on the second page.

And the videos that you mentioned belong to the matchup thread as the video thread are for matches/combo videos. As long as the video is pertinent, you can refer to it in your post..

What he said. Videos are perfectly fine and you really can't go wrong with posting them, so long as you are being specific in what you want to show, along with timestamp or time for longer videos.

[NecroTheReaper]

Anyone know if gad leis extends Relius' hitbox? Was wondering if it could be used for a somewhat safe oki without ignis since it has a fairly long range with frame advantage

[Elochai]

Do you guys usually end your midscreen combos in 214A or 214B? Out of habit, I keep doing 214A (> 22C) even though I think 214B is the better option being that they're knocked down and close to you. I'm not 100% about this either, but I think after 214B midscreen, you should be able to IAD j.A safely without fear of getting DP'd.

@Necro: So 41236B is completely safe no matter what? It can't even be punished by IB > 2A or something? That's interesting. I don't think Relius' hitbox extends beyond his body though.

[LordSpectreX]

Do you guys usually end your midscreen combos in 214A or 214B? Out of habit, I keep doing 214A (> 22C) even though I think 214B is the better option being that they're knocked down and close to you. I'm not 100% about this either, but I think after 214B midscreen, you should be able to IAD j.A safely without fear of getting DP'd.

@Necro: So 41236B is completely safe no matter what? It can't even be punished by IB > 2A or something? That's interesting. I don't think Relius' hitbox extends beyond his body though.

Surely the idea is that if you want to continue pressure, you go for 214B, if you want space (cause you want to zone or you need to charge ignis), then you should do 214A>22C

[TD]

choose which option depending on what you want to do. ignis running low on guage? you want to zone/run away for awhile? use 214a 22c. ignis high on guage and you want to rush? 214b.

not sure about the dp bit, but this is my preferred method of oki as well.

as for leis; it's +1 on normal block, so the least it could possibly be on block is -2. not punishable but not favorable. very high chance of both hits being blocked. also locks the foe in blockstun, the second hit can be ib'd almost for free. its slow startup makes this move overall gimmicky in pressure. no... it's more like shenanigans.

[NecroTheReaper]

On IB I think its barely safe, its +1 usually, but that's why I said appropriately spaced, which generally if you end a combo in j.214B you'd be spaced well enough. However, I dunno how meaty Leis would work, being 2 hits and all. That's why I was wondering if Relius had an extended hitbox

[Lich]

There's no point to do meaty Leis. The only thing Gad Leis should be used for outside of combos is to waste time while Ignis recharges, which you can accomplish mid blockstring. Even then it's kind of easy to recognize Leis before it hits and people can either run or mash out. Even if you space out Gad Leis perfectly, only +1 and with that much space between you and your opponent, you're not going to accomplish anything and they're just going to get out. If you're too close and they IB it you're at a disadvantage and now you have to block.

[NecroTheReaper]

This is just a question of preference really, do you guys like using j.B>j.C>j.236C>j.214B>air dash to put yourself close on wakeup or j.B>dj.B>j.C>j.236C>j.214A for more damage

[Kurushii]

The first one is pretty much a rule since CSE

[NecroTheReaper]

That's the one I followed in CSE but I saw alot of double jump RYO stuff so I was makin sure lol

[TD]

ok, so over this week be it today, saturday or any time in my spare time, i'm going to add a little more flesh to the matchup threads. things l am certain work as well as any tested/known info in the threads will begin finding their way to the OP.

i'm especially looking for certain things when it comes to the matchups:

*round start flowcharts

*dp's for each character and ways to beat and bait them, if applicable

*the foe's options as you wake up

of course whatever can be posted on the matchup is acceptable, but these 3 change the most between characters and are very important. for some of the older character l may be able to help with, like litchi, ragna, hazama, etc. there would need to be more specific specialists for the new characters, though. as said, any good info is greatly appreciated.

[WakeUpDP]

For the new characters, I've been playing the amane mod DerQ at locals and online for a few matches so I might add some week 1 info.

Although the matchup I could probably contribute the most is Tager since scene has a few of em. It's pretty much the one I played the most often both in extend and bbcp.

For the hakumen matchup, I could expand with my opinions of the big post that bladeofjustice7 made in the hakumen vs relius thread (in the hakumen section) after our big set of matches to start it.

Edited November 5, 2013 by WakeUpDP