High/low same time Blocking question

[Xeno]

Is it possible to block both high and low at the same time? If one attack hits you low and another attack hits you low and an overhead hits you on the same frame, is it impossible to block?

[Darkhonor90]

yes it would be impossible But its impossible for that situation to happen because anything to hit low and then transfer to high has to be on two separate frames there is no such thing as a true high and low hit at the same time that can't be blocked because everything can be done in 1 frame For instance Eddie's unblock ables are block able because if you can switch from low to high in that 1 frame then you can block it its just incredibly hard

[Koozebanian Fazoob]

Last time I messed with this was back in #R so I don't know if this is still all true but... the reason the Eddie type unblockables weren't technically unblockable is because you could apparently only get hit by 1 thing each frame. So technically you block one direction on one frame, then the other on the next. Keep in mind the last time I tested that was in #R, and it was just for Physical + Projectile high/low type unblockables, so I can't tell you if that still applies in AC or if there are other situations where it doesn't apply at all (which there probably are).

[excelence]

is it possible to switch defensive position during block stun from low to high/high low within that 1 frame?

[4r5]

it's possible. though successfully blocking a high+low unblockable is a feat in itself, since you basically have to guess if the high is going to hit first or if the low is going to hit first. and that's not even getting in to the ones that have multiple highs or lows.

[excelence]

duh... fb drill XD ... and thx

[Koozebanian Fazoob]

Yeah, don't get the impression that it's practical to do, because it really isn't. I've seen it done a few times though in matches.

[4r5]

when you got no other choice, you might as well try

[Sytha]

It's Possible. I've done it a few times. There is a Scrubby ass video somewhere of it. Not really practical But you should always try since you have nothing to lose.

[Xeno]

I was watching some I-no (I think the player was Kochi?) videos, and he was shooting the music note and FRCing it, but making it hit low, then running in and attacking mid/high and it seemed to work every time. With Projectiles+FRCs it would be possible to time this, no?

[excelence]

Projectile always hit Mid, Koichi use the flash that notes caused on blocked string to confuse the defender the similar theory like Tes Zeinest mix up

[SugataDesigns]

I'm confused as to how Roger Get can't be a perfect unblockable, unless people are saying that when two attacks hit on the exact same frame, they actually aren't both able to be active.

[Nhur]

ino notes not hit low :S

[excelence]

actually i have experience similar confusion with you, there's once in a while i'm hiting j.k and the opponent can block roger get with standing guard and it's been said only 1hit can be confirmed per-frame by the game engine ... i guess the exact term for UB's hit confirm of the first and the second of the two attack musn't be done on the exact same frame but must be done on the quick succession in the range of 1~4 frame rate?

[SugataDesigns]

actually i have experience similar confusion with you, there's once in a while i'm hiting j.k and the opponent can block roger get with standing guard and it's been said only 1hit can be confirmed per-frame by the game engine ... i guess the exact term for UB's hit confirm of the first and the second of the two attack musn't be done on the exact same frame but must be done on the quick succession in the range of 1~4 frame rate?

Ah, thanks for clearing that up. I was a bit confused because of how it was said (I wasn't sure if they were referring to the game engine or the characters lacking the ability to hit overhead/low at the same time, which is of course incorrect). I mainly referenced Roger Get to counteract the latter argument, because I main Bridget and that's an easy reference. I would've just stuck with Eddie, but I don't know the character at all (Not sure if his unblocks are "truly" (Character-wise, not game-engine wise - IE supposed to hit low/overhead same frame) unblocks or just nearly so.

[Hellmonkey]

Note that most of the time you see "unblockables" blocked, it's usually mistimed slightly by the person doing it. It's not really practical to switch your block perfectly after guessing right on the first hit correctly.

[Koozebanian Fazoob]

actually i have experience similar confusion with you, there's once in a while i'm hiting j.k and the opponent can block roger get with standing guard and it's been said only 1hit can be confirmed per-frame by the game engine ... i guess the exact term for UB's hit confirm of the first and the second of the two attack musn't be done on the exact same frame but must be done on the quick succession in the range of 1~4 frame rate?

What happens is that if two moves try to connect on the same frame, one of them will just not hit. But since most moves have more than 1F of active time, you tend to get hit the next frame anyway.

[rtl42]

ohhhh. in your test (in #R), could you tell which hit-type was consistently nullified for that one frame?

[excelence]

i think any hit with just 1 active frame or the unblockables connect on it's last active frame... that's what i think it happen on my Roger Get & j.k setup, and thx to clarifying things Gwirgyn i really forgot with the fact that some moves has multiple active frames (+_+)

[Shoto]

If you're speaking of AC and Eddie keep in mind that he has to be at a certain distance for his FB Drill + shadow –D- UB. If you could block it chances are good he was just too far away for the –D- to connect in time (only the first two hits of the FB Drill hit low, so it has to connect during those two). Wait for the sound of the second FB Drill hit, then immediately switch to high block. If his timing / spacing was off, you’ll be able to block it. Since it is often hard to figure out when this will happen I would say forget about this UB for further investigation :P. (btw.: You can create that situation to some extend if you FD the right hits (i.e. don’t block the second shadow –K- attack as it actually sucks you further in). Still you have to guess if he goes for the UB before he does and his timing / spacing still has to be slightly off.) back to topic: I've seen it once back in #R where ATG blocked the Eddie UB trough pure luck.. there even should be a video of that match, but again it was back in #R. Still I‘d guess the same mechanics should apply. So theoretically the only "real unblockables" should be setups that actually involves real unblockable moves, like Pots slidehead trap or Axls meaty rashousen setup; but practically it simply doesn’t matter.

[Koozebanian Fazoob]

ohhhh.

in your test (in #R), could you tell which hit-type was consistently nullified for that one frame?

I seem to recall that the physical hit would connect first, then the projectile. But again I have no idea how that would work with Eddie's new double projectile unblockable. It's really easy to test actually, just record the unblockable in training mode, then record a vid of you holding only high block VS only low block. You should see something got blocked in one of them.

[Digital Watches]

but practically it simply doesn’t matter.

Eh, that's not quite true. If it's really true that Eddie's UB setups aren't truly unblockable, getting good at the 1-frame-guard-switch and just taking the chance on the 50-50 is better than just getting hit every time. Of course there's no way to guarantee it, but at least it's possible to get out.

[Mr. Dogma]

What happens is that if two moves try to connect on the same frame, one of them will just not hit. But since most moves have more than 1F of active time, you tend to get hit the next frame anyway.

So reiterating what you said: Move A and Move B hit at the same, but one of the two is nullified because you can't have 2 moves hit on the exact same frame, but because of active frames, one of those 2 moves will continue and then cause a hit on the next possible frame.

So, doesn't that mean that, assuming you're just awesome and can hit the 1F guard switch every time, you could still get hit because you don't know which move will get nullified, essentially making your decision on which way to block a flip of a coin?

[Koozebanian Fazoob]

Well, it seems that certain hits will always come first. If it's projectile+physical hit, the physical hit always comes first. I have no idea about projectile/projectile though. So basically in theory you could always just block the physical hit then the projectile hit. Of course, then all the other player has to do is alter his timing very slightly and they can hit the other way around. It's a cool idea in theory, but really it's still mostly impossible to do with any sort of regularity.

[Mr. Dogma]

Well yeah, I'd be impressed if anyone could do that consistently, but I was just curious. It seemed like such an interesting hypothetical situation.