Jugiatsu Posted July 2, 2010 Posted July 2, 2010 BB is not srs busness --Hopes and dreams of being a professional BB player crushed-- :sad: I'll stick to blocking, if I IB the Crescent (point blank), I can FC 2c her, which goes into dive loop 100% curse, more rewarding and guaranteed than chicken blocking or abare. If she feints, then it's anyone's game unless I'm conditioned properly. So even then, in the end its all about guessing whether or not she will feint. If she doesn't and you IB, Lambda=raped. If she does though and you don't call it you are hosed. This is why I will always suck at fighters. I cannot read my opponents worth diddly squat. Which makes mirror matches even more infuriating for me. Other Lambda players can read whether I TK or not all the time it seems while I on the other hand am not so lucky. Back to practice I suppose.
tuka Posted July 2, 2010 Posted July 2, 2010 So I checked out Bang's j.D, which turned out to be nonpunishable in any conceivable way. You can TRY and 6A/airthrow it but god help you if you eat a counter (you will).
Skye Posted July 2, 2010 Posted July 2, 2010 So even then, in the end its all about guessing whether or not she will feint. If she doesn't and you IB, Lambda=raped. If she does though and you don't call it you are hosed. This is why I will always suck at fighters. I cannot read my opponents worth diddly squat. Which makes mirror matches even more infuriating for me. Other Lambda players can read whether I TK or not all the time it seems while I on the other hand am not so lucky. Such is the spirit of competitive play. A two sided street.
Hintalove Posted July 24, 2010 Posted July 24, 2010 Sorry to necro this discussion of reaction times and frame data, but one aspect of the argument that some how went untouched was the fact that regardless of an overhead having "x" start-up time, you usually do not recognize the ambiguous early frames, so for example the jumping frames are kind of a non-issue since you wont realise she jumped until shes already in the air. The other aspect is that these kind of mixups can often be fuzzy guarded(japanese terminology), meaning that you can used canned blocking patterns to beat the results. For example even if Nu cancels the overhead, you can block high until the point that she could low/throw and then defend properly from that point. This works against a lot of mixups, but if characters have multiple options that fork into more options(like millia or i-no for example) these strategies wont work.
kenja0 Posted July 24, 2010 Posted July 24, 2010 You will get those who are really skilled and practice those defensive options, and you will get those who have played against someone enough times to counter them fully. Luckily, all these problems are solved by human error. No one's perfect- just keep them on their toes and they'll slip up sometime: you can't make progress by turtling.
germanturkey Posted July 27, 2010 Posted July 27, 2010 alright. i'm finding it hard to dash after throw. wtf.
Overheat Posted July 27, 2010 Posted July 27, 2010 Keep on practicing. I literally kept on throwing until I could get the dashing time down.
severin Posted July 27, 2010 Posted July 27, 2010 Deutschetürkei: Another thing to note, is that the dash can be done surprisingly late, and is usually better done that way, as the lower you hit them with the 6A, the more hits you'll get out of 6C
germanturkey Posted July 27, 2010 Posted July 27, 2010 yeah, i'll just keep on trying. i also can't air throw and rapid fast enough. haha. difficulties..
Master Chibi Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 Ugh this bitch is totally different from CT. Ah well.
Antihippy Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 yeah, i'll just keep on trying. i also can't air throw and rapid fast enough. haha. difficulties.. It's pretty much the exact time as you land from what i remember. Just keep practicing. The timing isn't too hard really. Ugh this bitch is totally different from CT. Ah well. Welcome to the club.
Arcade Fire87 Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 So, now that 5D doesn't have its mixups anymore. What are good options and what's normally smart to do? I've been using a lot of 5DD>214D some 5D>236C 5DD>4DD Not sure what I should do for most 5DDs It doesn't feel like Lambda can be played as differently now as Nu, I think it's because Jump cancels are less occuring for mind games.
Overheat Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 5DD > 4DD only if they're crouching. Does it still combo if they're hit by 5DD in the air? I personally would do 5DD > 214D.
Arcade Fire87 Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 214D is your best pressure option. I noticed, it was mainly what I used, with a little 4DD and 236C in case they tried mashing jump (Saw AZU use it well). 236D is working for now, but this is crazy punishable against good players, a little afraid to use it and don't want to use it a lot just because it works on people new at this game. Out of curiousity, how long did it take you guys to do your TK loops reliably?
germanturkey Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 she just feels a lot clunkier. no idea why. like she felt find when i played her in the arcade, but now she just feels sloooooow. possibly because i played a lot of CT between the last time i went to the arcade and now. they did increase startup and recovery on a good amount of her normals. but its expected. come on december.. ha, haven't gotten my tk loop down yet. i haven't found a reliable way to actually GET to the point where i can tk loop. i'm guessing corner throw is the way to go?
Overheat Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 I don't have CS yet, but I've literally immersed myself in Lambda videos, and I've changed my Nu to play like I want my Lambda to. I can only do 3 reps of the TK loop (the frame data for 6A and j.214D hasn't changed a lot, if it has at all). I've seen a Lambda do j.DD (hit confirm) > j.214D~C > j.DD > dj.2DD etc. so I do that quite a bit. Corner throw is the easiest IMO 236D has a very long start-up time, but it's very good on block.
germanturkey Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 yeah, 236d is trash unless you have them in stuck in 236236d or you're playing tager.. and yes, jdd > j214c~d > jdd > j2dd is the main zoning tool now that i use. i started using it as soon as i saw that you couldn't link 5dd and 4dd any more.
kenja0 Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 she just feels a lot clunkier. no idea why. like she felt find when i played her in the arcade, but now she just feels sloooooow. possibly because i played a lot of CT between the last time i went to the arcade and now. they did increase startup and recovery on a good amount of her normals. but its expected. come on december.. ha, haven't gotten my tk loop down yet. i haven't found a reliable way to actually GET to the point where i can tk loop. i'm guessing corner throw is the way to go? A lot of the characters feel clunkier according to my other friends who main them. First one to beat all of Lambda's challenges gets a prize: I've only finished the first 7.
Locke815 Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 So I just found out 2 of my favorite Nu RC combos can be be done with Lambda contrary to what I was told by Severin a couple of months ago 1. CH 2C>6C>2DD>j.2C>j.C>j.2C>214D>RC>5DD>6DD>2DD>j.DD> j.2DD>214D ~ 2500 dmg 2. CH 2C>6C>2DD>j.2C>214D>RC>dash>6C>6DD>2DD>j.DD> j.2DD>214D ~ 2800 dmg The 2nd one tends to have a more stricter timing and watch for the height as well. Even though these were 4500+ with Nu, I'm just glad its in CS. Lambda's new and improve version of these RC combos: 1. 236C>dash>5CxN>6C>2DD>j.2C>214D>RC>5DD>6DD>2DD>j.DD> j.2DD>214D ~ 4100 dmg 2. 236C>dash>5CxN>6C>2DD>j.2C>214D>RC>dash>6C>6DD>2DD>j.DD> j.2DD>214D ~ 4300 dmg There is possibly more dmg to come out of these combos since I'm not done playing around with them yet.
Overheat Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 =/ I thought CH 2C makes the opponent OTG which means no 3C? You probably meant 6C. And those Nu combos have a lot more potential, but I'm guessing you do them to be flashy or they are your favourite combos, etc. Severin probably meant that those exact combos could not be done. Some Nu combos do work with Lambda, and a lot of Nu's combo enders are the same as Lambda's.
dorushi Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 I don't have CS yet, but I've literally immersed myself in Lambda videos, and I've changed my Nu to play like I want my Lambda to. I can only do 3 reps of the TK loop (the frame data for 6A and j.214D hasn't changed a lot, if it has at all). I've seen a Lambda do j.DD (hit confirm) > j.214D~C > j.DD > dj.2DD etc. so I do that quite a bit. Corner throw is the easiest IMO 236D has a very long start-up time, but it's very good on block. no amount of nu practice can help you with lambda imo its kinda like playing a new character but you can probably adapt better than me.. I think someone said it before and its probably just due to me playing her for the first time but some of her combos look easy but with the varying height of tk, the delay you sometimes have to do makes her big hitting combos as of right now pretty hard even when the tk hits they can still tech I dont even know the margin of error. I also think theres a bit of randomness based on how fast you can press 5C and when you input 236C and where they will bounce again probably due to just playing her but shes really different imo I think I seen a couple vids where people did 5D-4dd it seems kinda gimmicky to me is it any good... anyone have any tips on the loop how in the heck does the guy not move back while 6a tk in challenge 9 im assuming hes doing 214789 or something like that but im using a pad and so far cant do that locke those are nice combos but I think lambda can get that damage just from a 236C using a tk but right now thats pretty hard
Overheat Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 Sorry, but I think Nu practice can help you with Lambda. Lambda's normals aren't that different from Nu's. The only changes are 5C doesn't change directions if your opponent crosses you up, 2C isn't insanely good, and her normals in general are more punishable. I've switched my Nu to a melee Nu, and almost everything I do with melee Nu does work with Lambda. I've seen videos of Lambda doing the things I do with my Nu. So I basically picked a style of Lambda that I like, and applied it to Nu. Obviously the combos will be different, but I'll fix those problems with time. Basically, I'm arguing that the way I play my Nu will work for CS. And what I do isn't too risky and is something most Lambda's/Nu's should do anyways. So how about a friendly bet? I think that the way I play my Nu will work for CS, and I think that it will be just as effective, if not more effective because of Lambda's new Parcers. What you're saying is that playing Nu doesn't help prepare you for Lambda...
severin Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 So I just found out 2 of my favorite Nu RC combos can be be done with Lambda contrary to what I was told by Severin a couple of months ago 1. CH 2C>6C>2DD>j.2C>j.C>j.2C>214D>RC>5DD>6DD>2DD>j.DD> j.2DD>214D ~ 2500 dmg 2. CH 2C>6C>2DD>j.2C>214D>RC>dash>6C>6DD>2DD>j.DD> j.2DD>214D ~ 2800 dmg The 2nd one tends to have a more stricter timing and watch for the height as well. Even though these were 4500+ with Nu, I'm just glad its in CS. Lambda's new and improve version of these RC combos: 1. 236C>dash>5CxN>6C>2DD>j.2C>214D>RC>5DD>6DD>2DD>j.DD> j.2DD>214D ~ 4100 dmg 2. 236C>dash>5CxN>6C>2DD>j.2C>214D>RC>dash>6C>6DD>2DD>j.DD> j.2DD>214D ~ 4300 dmg There is possibly more dmg to come out of these combos since I'm not done playing around with them yet. Why would you want to do these combos though? Her meterless options do more damage. For instance: Off of 236C, you can do: 236C > Dash > 5C(8) > 6C > Dash > 2DD > 2148D > 5DD > 6DD etc (4300) or 236C > Dash > 5C(8) > 214A > Dash 6A > 2148D > 5C(8) > 6C > 236C > 2DD > jDD > etc (4700) and off of 2C (why are you getting counterhit 2C's tell me your secret) 2C (CH) > 6C > Dash 2DD > 2148D > 5DD > 236C > 2DD > etc for about 3500 if i recall correctly. you could probably even do 2C (CH) > 6C > Dash 2DD > 2148D > 5DD > 2336> Dash > 2DD > 2148D > 5DD > 6DD etc, and get close to 4k.
dorushi Posted July 28, 2010 Posted July 28, 2010 Sorry, but I think Nu practice can help you with Lambda. Lambda's normals aren't that different from Nu's. The only changes are 5C doesn't change directions if your opponent crosses you up, 2C isn't insanely good, and her normals in general are more punishable. I've switched my Nu to a melee Nu, and almost everything I do with melee Nu does work with Lambda. I've seen videos of Lambda doing the things I do with my Nu. So I basically picked a style of Lambda that I like, and applied it to Nu. Obviously the combos will be different, but I'll fix those problems with time. Basically, I'm arguing that the way I play my Nu will work for CS. And what I do isn't too risky and is something most Lambda's/Nu's should do anyways. So how about a friendly bet? I think that the way I play my Nu will work for CS, and I think that it will be just as effective, if not more effective because of Lambda's new Parcers. What you're saying is that playing Nu doesn't help prepare you for Lambda... hopefully I didnt come off rude or anything, of course if you mained nu your probably going to do a bit better than someone who didnt, in fact my nu was probably 50/50 zoning/melee at the end of CT and Im having a hard time myself and for people with incredible defense I think you actually need to go in close, what I'm saying is your not going to be "prepared" for lambda so to speak shes just alot harder than nu imo with alot less easy damage, I dont think it going to be a simple or even an easy transition just because nu was so good (you might be "prepared" who knows, we're on different networks and it might just be easy for you). I actually think lambda's should try to go in close to get tks, bait ib and punish and go for big damage because its not going to come from a standard sword or counter 2C so theres really no need for a friendly wager because I think your thinking about a melee semi-rushdown lambda which I think is fine and better than a complete zoning lambda
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