TheDarkWall Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 (edited) Ya , I've been playing allot of non arksys fighters lately dabbling in 3d moving back to 2d with this and persona. But anyways to stay on topic I do wonder how different it is going to be. They do say you can shift between characters involved in the story arc......sorta like how you shift between characters when you select them in ct or cs story modes. I wonder if they're just saying that they're going to try to make 3 different arcs involving the characters tie into 1 but keep the idividuality. Sort of like one group is bang and his group, one the ragna squad trying to figure out stuff so on, and one the sector seven group doing their usual stuff. If thats the case then thats fine and it would be cool to have that many plot lines swirling around as long as the game is forced to linear without alternate circumstances. But oh well I guess we are left to twiddle our thumbs for now and wonder for quite some time on anything story related. EDIT just read SOWL's post. Are you talking about sort of how I'm saying here. I mean I just dont see branching stories working out to well for all characters if they're going for a storyline like 3 MK storylines essentially. Alternating paths would conflict and make it convoluted that way. I suppose you could have something of a map that you navigate the story line by so progression is still made clear and alternate paths are still available. Edited August 16, 2012 by TheDarkWall
SoWL Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 EDIT just read SOWL's post. Are you talking about sort of how I'm saying here. I mean I just dont see branching stories working out to well for all characters if they're going for a storyline like 3 MK storylines essentially. Alternating paths would conflict and make it convoluted that way. I suppose you could have something of a map that you navigate the story line by so progression is still made clear and alternate paths are still available. A map is a good idea, but I was talking about the branches that don't go for too long, maybe for a single scene, and that focus on a single character. For example, some Bang-centric scene may give you a choice between proceeding with the story properly or reading his gag reel. Basically, something like proper visual novel system would fit well here.
Pete278 Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 Alternatively, they could do gag reels based on you losing a certain fight
Isuna Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 people should stop acting like if Hakumen is fairly balanced and take a tremendous effort to play srsly No reason to nerf him to D-tier. I take it from your avatar that you play Makoto. You should know what I am talking about.
Vulcan422 Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 (edited) What they need to do is stop nerfing the tools that make the characters unique. Stop making the styles homogenized and just tweak already existing tools to help them in that regard. In Hakumen's case I feel he's more suited for playing patiently using his pokes, counters, and Fumajins to build meter for the damaging shit. Being forced to play him offensively is the reason why I dropped him and switched to Bang in CS onward. Speaking of Bang, bring back wall-bounce moves for God's sake. Wall-bound and wall-stick moves are fine too but only for certain characters like Valkenhayn. I don't see why Arcsys is suddenly afraid of wall-bounce moves now. Edited August 16, 2012 by Vulcan422
zeakikung Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 please ASW "Nerf" not "Destroy" the characters.
Lord Pwnge18 Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 please ASW "Nerf" not "Destroy" the characters. You've never played CS2 Makoto, have you?
zeakikung Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 You've never played CS2 Makoto, have you? My friend stop playing her since EX because of super nerf
Godlike Assault Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 My friend stop playing her since EX because of super nerf So he played Ragna on extend?
TheDarkWall Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 What they need to do is stop nerfing the tools that make the characters unique. Stop making the styles homogenized and just tweak already existing tools to help them in that regard. In Hakumen's case I feel he's more suited for playing patiently using his pokes, counters, and Fumajins to build meter for the damaging shit. Being forced to play him offensively is the reason why I dropped him and switched to Bang in CS onward. Speaking of Bang, bring back wall-bounce moves for God's sake. Wall-bound and wall-stick moves are fine too but only for certain characters like Valkenhayn. I don't see why Arcsys is suddenly afraid of wall-bounce moves now. I have to disagree with the destroy comment. I cant speak for characters like hakumen or makoto as I don't really play them but bang I feel has very much benefited from his nerfs in terms of how he plays. The wall bounces made combos much more repetative and in CS overpowered him. Now hes forced to use allot more of his tools in combos and they look much more interesting and can have much more spontaneous innovation since you aren't chained down to wallbounce > rising combo > air wall bounce > ender format. Not to mention the nerfs he got made it so you actually have to use the tools at his disposal that make him unique. Back in CS you COULD use his bumpers.......or play normal and it wouldn't matter because you had so much damage and were so great overall that you didn't really need to play right in order to win with him and could play far worse than your opponent and still win. It was very unsatisfying. I personally haven't gotten too far into extend, but from what I could tell and what I played in cs2, bangs changes have been great..... even if I do miss nail frkz dashes and the mobility in general.
Manta Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 I have to disagree with the destroy comment. I cant speak for characters like hakumen or makoto as I don't really play them but bang I feel has very much benefited from his nerfs in terms of how he plays. The wall bounces made combos much more repetative and in CS overpowered him. Now hes forced to use allot more of his tools in combos and they look much more interesting and can have much more spontaneous innovation since you aren't chained down to wallbounce > rising combo > air wall bounce > ender format. Not to mention the nerfs he got made it so you actually have to use the tools at his disposal that make him unique. Back in CS you COULD use his bumpers.......or play normal and it wouldn't matter because you had so much damage and were so great overall that you didn't really need to play right in order to win with him and could play far worse than your opponent and still win. It was very unsatisfying. I personally haven't gotten too far into extend, but from what I could tell and what I played in cs2, bangs changes have been great..... even if I do miss nail frkz dashes and the mobility in general. It seems like you're agreeing with the spirit of the notion. Having bang's generic wallbounce combos gone emphasised bumpers, nails and clever use of guardpoints, thus emphasising what makes him unique, not just a generic punch-kick fighter with some gimmicks you won't bother with.
YukiBlue Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 Id rather have the option than be forced to use it. Bumpers and Guardpoints will never play a solid, integral role in Bangs gameplay. Ever.
Zio_IV Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 This just popped into my head, but I'm curious if Doug Erholtz and Tony Oliver are still going to voice Hazama and Bang. I'm hoping it was just a temporary thing in CS2 and CSEX, like maybe they had schedule conflicts at that time or something, idunno. Spencer's portrayal of Hazama actually wasn't all that bad (still jarring, however), but Kramer's version of Bang just didn't sound right at all.
SoWL Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 Id rather have the option than be forced to use it. Bumpers and Guardpoints will never play a solid, integral role in Bangs gameplay. Ever. But doesn't making the rest of the options better force you to use them, as well? I've never played Bang, but I think that having a character who doesn't need his Drive contradicts BB's design.
2Zak Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 Id rather have the option than be forced to use it. Ada will never play a solid, integral role in Carl's gameplay. Ever. Just imagine this That shit is there to be used, if that shit sucks compared to all other shit he has, then it's a terrible character design.
The Noble Clap Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 I'd rather have the option than be forced to use it. Bumpers and Guardpoints will never play a solid, integral role in Bangs gameplay. Ever. Bumpers are gdlk. I don't even know what Bang players you watch/fight, but if they don't use Bumpers, there's a decent chance they shouldn't be playing Bang. Bumpers are better than D nails. Guardpoints can be used on when you read an attack/projectile to do a left/right or go away. Not a solid part though.
zeth07 Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 Just imagine this That shit is there to be used, if that shit sucks compared to all other shit he has, then it's a terrible character design. In my opinion, Bang's character design/tools are hurt simply due to the game's own mechanics. In particular the tech roll system. I always say it, but if BB had GG oki Bang would be an amazing character. But it isn't GG, it is BB. Bumpers are gdlk. I don't even know what Bang players you watch/fight, but if they don't use Bumpers, there's a decent chance they shouldn't be playing Bang. Bumpers are better than D nails. Guardpoints can be used on when you read an attack/projectile to do a left/right or go away. Not a solid part though. I disagree. Bumpers can be useful, but they are a gimmick at best. BB's oki pretty much tarnishes the effectiveness of bumpers. They are useful during pressure strings, but they are entirely situational since it depends on where they are once you start your pressure. They can be useful at neutral for moving around, but unless you are using them on reaction to your opponent doing something really slow, it is still just a guessing game at neutral. Bumpers are a tool that can serve a purpose, but they aren't a required part of his gameplay. FRKZ is another perfect example of this. Compared to say Carl using Nirvana, it is the entire function of the character's design. As for saying Bang players shouldn't be playing Bang if they don't use these things, I always mention Minami's Bang when he was playing him to show that you don't need to use those things to be a great player. I like the idea of having options and being able to play different ways with the character, it lets each player be more unique which is one thing I like about Bang compared to other characters. Due to Bang having a limited resource with nails, you have to choose how you want to play the character and use those tools. If they decided to change things and pretty much force him to go for certain things, it probably wouldn't be as fun. FRKZ is what always comes to mind. With FRKZ being his Overdrive now, it is like they are saying you SHOULD be using it, while before it was more of a choice. Now that choice comes down to you not using it and only using your burst defensively, or using it but sacrificing that defensive burst. I don't know how I feel about that at this point, so I'll reserve judgment til I actually see the final version or play the game myself. He has all these tools that lets him play differently (now) which is good, but I just feel like he's held back by design due to the game itself.
Vulcan422 Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 This just popped into my head, but I'm curious if Doug Erholtz and Tony Oliver are still going to voice Hazama and Bang. I'm hoping it was just a temporary thing in CS2 and CSEX, like maybe they had schedule conflicts at that time or something, idunno. Spencer's portrayal of Hazama actually wasn't all that bad (still jarring, however), but Kramer's version of Bang just didn't sound right at all. Just some clarifications. -Keep in mind that Erholtz only did Hazama for Extend. Erik Davies has been his voice since CT, and I honestly prefer his Extend voice over his CT/CS voice since it makes him sound more like the smug asshole troll that Hazama is. -On Bang, everyone hated his Extend voice, no doubt about that. Oliver makes him sound much more hilarious and over-the-top, as he should be since he's a Toku parody, and Oliver just so happens to practically be the main reason why we have Power Rangers.
The Noble Clap Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 Ok, what I said came out harsh and absolute-y, so sorry about that. Bang has lots of good playstyles and stuff, so the ones I play could just be different. I still think bumpers are a good tool that can be used combos and mix-ups. Does anyone think that it will be better to hold out on a long, damaging combo to use an overdrive after you tech, or to burst out earlier?
Zio_IV Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 Just some clarifications. -Keep in mind that Erholtz only did Hazama for Extend. Erik Davies has been his voice since CT, and I honestly prefer his Extend voice over his CT/CS voice since it makes him sound more like the smug asshole troll that Hazama is. -On Bang, everyone hated his Extend voice, no doubt about that. Oliver makes him sound much more hilarious and over-the-top, as he should be since he's a Toku parody, and Oliver just so happens to practically be the main reason why we have Power Rangers. Really? I'm honestly a little surprised I didn't know that. I've been playing since 2010 and I was sure Erholtz was the one doing Hazama the whole time. That's uncanny... Still, I'm hoping it stays that way. Spike Spencer got the "psycho" part down pretty well, but he just wasn't.. troll-tastic enough, I guess. Tony Oliver is the only english Bang, as far as I'm concerned. His whole portrayal of Bang, both him as a character and him as a parody, is just way too fitting. I suppose the only thing about the voices I'm left to wonder is what they're going to do with good ol' Hakumen. I noticed they altered it in CSEX so it doesn't sound so much like Vincent's "Jin" (which it certainly did), but I wonder if they're going to keep it that way, or if Vincent is going to attempt to make them sound different himself this time around.
Putin Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 English Haz is... okay ingame, but when it comes to story mode Not trying to be a weaboo here, but JP Haz is godlike and almost sounds impossible for someone else to do a better job than Nakamura. He's an ok va overall, but he makes me cream my pants in BB.
mAc Chaos Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 I hated what they did to Hakumen's voice in Extend. It sounded like someone fell asleep while messing with the sounds. I always liked whoever played Hazama in CT. He sounded calm and enigmatic, but his ghost form sounded pretty troll.
Zio_IV Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 Most of the time, I default to liking the JP voice acting in most works, but I always listen to the dubs in case they did a good job with it. Blazblue has a pretty damn good dubbing imo, with there being only a few characters I like a lot more in the JP version (Tetsuya Kakihara's performance comes to mind). Here's hoping they include a feature that allows you to choose between JP and dub specific to each character. Not likely, but there's hope.
StarGazer Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 (edited) No reason to nerf him to D-tier. I take it from your avatar that you play Makoto. You should know what I am talking about. If you placed CP loketest Hakumen in Extend then he will look ugly for sure but CP is a much different game with new standards that looks much lower till now, everyone got nerfed in CP even Makoto so have faith in him turning up good especially since this is only the first loketest. Speaking of the way in which the changes happened, the nerfs to Hakumen's drive might be a follow up to the general change that happened to the game reward and less passive gamestyle. But he still fits his unique Tank role and will attract a lot of players who like this style unlike the changes that kept happening to Makoto in every game were she kept loosing tools and options (she even lost her high damage, sexy combos and oki setups which was a big entertaining aspect of her gamestyle). Edited August 16, 2012 by StarGazer
Litherain-XIII Posted August 16, 2012 Posted August 16, 2012 a big broken aspect of her gamestyle. but thats in the past i guess..
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