Konton Posted September 16, 2010 Posted September 16, 2010 Well if you can condition them to block 5a after j.b jump-ins then you can start to omit the 5a and do the jump drive cancel into d.6b, d.6d, d.214d, or d.5c -> jc -> w/e.... etc etc.
dragontamer Posted September 16, 2010 Posted September 16, 2010 I call d.6B useless because its reward is pretty low, and its risk is high, because you have to be in drive to pull it off. Hell if you are far enough away from your opponent I can't imagine you can even get a combo off. 1 CR Left: d.6B -> 623D -> 66C in the corner / Rapid. From Alternative Standing Reset. 2 CR Left: d.6B -> d.5D -> 623D -> 66C if you got really good timing. Corner or Rapid makes it easier. From CR Oki. 3 CR Left: d.6B -> d.6A -> d.6C -> 623D -> 66C is pretty easy. From Standing Reset. 4 CR Left: d.6B -> d.6A -> d.6C -> d.6D -> 623D -> 66C is also fine. From (j.d) cancel. All can end with 236D into Oki. 3 and 4 can go d.5C -> j.D -> d.5A for standing reset if you prefer that. I guess "eternally Useless" was a bad way to phrase it, maybe more like "situationally useless", I guess I might have to start using j.D in blockstrings to learn to appreciate d.6B more? No. j.C -> (j.D cancel) -> d.6B is pretty damn effective. Time it right, and the j.D never comes out. Its one of Noel's effective tricks IMO.
LunaKage Posted September 16, 2010 Posted September 16, 2010 You guys have to forgive me, I miss her normals so much that I have a great disdain for her drives. I'll start trying some of this though.
Sol.Badguy Posted September 17, 2010 Posted September 17, 2010 Hmm can someone explain this J.D cancel into D.6B for me please? Just starting to learn noel :] thanks
ThunderboltZ28 Posted September 17, 2010 Posted September 17, 2010 Hmm can someone explain this J.D cancel into D.6B for me please? Just starting to learn noel :] thanks Yes how and when would you do something like this?
TransientFaith Posted September 17, 2010 Posted September 17, 2010 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZN9bRvw7uE#t=1m15s this applies in CS as well, pretty useful
dragontamer Posted September 17, 2010 Posted September 17, 2010 Hmm can someone explain this J.D cancel into D.6B for me please? Just starting to learn noel :] thanks Sounds like something I need to put into the updated guide. Here's the essence. j.D will NOT come out if you are too low. So, right before you land, you hit j.D. If you do this correctly, you'll glow black and then Noel will reload her guns when she lands. How is this useful? You can use ANY drive-followup attack during this period, without actually using a starter. The "n00b" example would be: jump -> (j.D cancel, j.D doesn't come out) -> 214D. (Assault through) This "instantly" allows you to use 214D from any landing. This is the noob example because its flashy but kinda worthless at high level play. But play around with it, you'll get people at low level play because they don't expect 214D unless you're in chain revolver mode. The most useful one in my experience is the d.6B followup, because its a fast overhead that occurs after landing. It seems to catch more opponents than normal 6B... then again, d.6B is faster than 6B. You do this by jump -> (j.D cancel) -> d.6B. You can do this from any landing. A generally useful place is of course... when you're jumping in. For example, jump -> j.C -> j.D cancel -> d.6B / d.214D.
Halcyone3 Posted September 17, 2010 Posted September 17, 2010 the format for that is j.D(doesn't come out)->your drive move but there's another way to use the D specials using this trick. Instead of doing j.D->623D(for example, works for 214D and 236D too), u can do j.623D, the D from 623D counts for both 623D and j.D, and i found it very easy to do vs j.D->drive move when i started learning this trick, made learning it easier
ThunderboltZ28 Posted September 17, 2010 Posted September 17, 2010 Sounds like something I need to put into the updated guide. Here's the essence. j.D will NOT come out if you are too low. So, right before you land, you hit j.D. If you do this correctly, you'll glow black and then Noel will reload her guns when she lands. How is this useful? You can use ANY drive-followup attack during this period, without actually using a starter. The "n00b" example would be: jump -> (j.D cancel, j.D doesn't come out) -> 214D. (Assault through) This "instantly" allows you to use 214D from any landing. This is the noob example because its flashy but kinda worthless at high level play. But play around with it, you'll get people at low level play because they don't expect 214D unless you're in chain revolver mode. The most useful one in my experience is the d.6B followup, because its a fast overhead that occurs after landing. It seems to catch more opponents than normal 6B... then again, d.6B is faster than 6B. You do this by jump -> (j.D cancel) -> d.6B. You can do this from any landing. A generally useful place is of course... when you're jumping in. For example, jump -> j.C -> j.D cancel -> d.6B / d.214D. I think I may have done the j.D cancel by accident a few times. I wondered why I was doing assault through as soon as I hit the ground. I'm going to practice that more. If you're going to add this to the guide maybe you can add how you do that oki stuff you guys are always talking about?
dragontamer Posted September 17, 2010 Posted September 17, 2010 The Chain-Revolver Oki stuff is semi-gimmicky, you need to be paying attention to your opponent's heat as well as know the matchups to use it effectively. I have discussed it at length in the other topic. Okay, its flat out a gimmick, a gimmick that punishes opponents if they don't know about it, but I guess a tech trap is always a good tool to have. I also have a video tutorial about the setup here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PM385yf1jg8
ThunderboltZ28 Posted September 17, 2010 Posted September 17, 2010 Oki stuff is semi-gimmicky, you need to be paying attention to your opponent's heat as well as know the matchups to use it effectively. I have discussed it at length in the other topic. Okay, its flat out a gimmick, a gimmick that punishes opponents if they don't know about it, but I guess a tech trap is always a good tool to have. I also have a video tutorial about the setup here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PM385yf1jg8 I see. It looks like I need to figure out that spring raid into 6C timing. You do so much damage in the corner!
dragontamer Posted September 17, 2010 Posted September 17, 2010 Lots of damage only on clean d.6C, which is like... stupid opponents who wakeup incorrectly lol. I guess Guard Crush also gives you clean d.6C, but you get a damage penalty on guard crush combos. Also, know your corner combos!! Practically every combo worth knowing in the corner gives you 4k damage... or 5k if you add the super in at the end. 5K off of 5D counter-hit, 5k off of 3C, 5k off of throw... you want your opponent to be pinned against the corner.
ThunderboltZ28 Posted September 17, 2010 Posted September 17, 2010 I definitely need help in the corner. I always get my opponent into the corner and I let them escape without doing any damage at all. I just ordered a fightstick so I'm going to be practicing nonstop.
Shieru-sensei Posted September 18, 2010 Posted September 18, 2010 I must say, I'm a bit affraid of this patch. Not "OMG, I'm going to die" affraid, of course, but "This will be a lot less fun than it was before" kind of affraid... I guess that's just the scrub in me =)
HeartNana Posted September 19, 2010 Posted September 19, 2010 I dunno, getting hit by less dumb random attacks from litchi/bang into death seems more fun to me.
LunaKage Posted September 19, 2010 Posted September 19, 2010 I dunno, getting hit by less dumb random attacks from litchi/bang into death seems more fun to me. This right here xN Seems like no matter what attack they connect with, its over for Noel. Litchi's anti-air into 5k and corner oki especially pisses me off. Then there's Bang's 5A...
Sol.Badguy Posted September 19, 2010 Posted September 19, 2010 Thanks for the explanation Dragon I appreciate it.
ThunderboltZ28 Posted September 19, 2010 Posted September 19, 2010 I have problems with Hazama. All I find online are Hazama and they all stab me to death.
Doom Dragon 103 Posted September 19, 2010 Author Posted September 19, 2010 I hear the patch comes out on Monday - tomorrow - along with Valk. Are these rumors true?
ThunderboltZ28 Posted September 19, 2010 Posted September 19, 2010 I thought it was Valk this month, Plat next month, and the patch sometime at the end of the year?
GunslingerSonic Posted September 23, 2010 Posted September 23, 2010 Valk is coming out on the 28th, everyone should know that. I got a question, its said that Heider * B narrow range. * C increase stiffness? Stiffness appears to mean more recovery according to DC What do this mean? What's going to happen to Noel's Haida Loop?
LunaKage Posted September 23, 2010 Posted September 23, 2010 Valk is coming out on the 28th, everyone should know that. I got a question, its said that What do this mean? What's going to happen to Noel's Haida Loop? This is old news man, get with the times. Really though, apparently haida loops are still possible, from what I heard the change to the silencers aren't even noticeable during haida loops.
wighti Posted September 23, 2010 Posted September 23, 2010 + It was said that the machines at the first test were running with some serious input delay, making it really hard to gauge some stuff like that.
2 GB Combo Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 From the October 8th loke test. Noel - Noel D moves changed - Bloom Trigger slides - No more HAIDA combos - Noel SPRING RAID knocks across the screen, can't followup unless in corner. 5D even slower. Uhhhh, I really do not know what to think about these changes, it seems like they want to make Noel suck even more. No haida, no Spring Raid to 6C combos, I don't even know how Noel will be able to get decent damage midscreen anymore. I'm interested in how Noel D moves have changed, but I'm speculating that they aren't good changes.
Mizzet Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 "Noel D moves changed" Does this mean entirely new moves? Like how d.5c changed completely from CT to CS, or just stuff like adjusting hitstun/proration values etc. Spring raid launching in that direction definitely means no more 623d 66c combos outside the corner, and no haida loops either so there goes our damaging options off 6b/3c (you either went haida or 623d 66c route). I'm not liking this. Bloom Trigger sliding I guess just gives time for you to run over and pressure on wakeup, oki basically, it's already able to do that though. Unless it slides so long you can run over and relaunch with 2b, who knows, maybe mid combo 236d 66 2b relaunch might be a new thing going. If they changed around Noel's chain revolver attacks, we'll probably be able to find new combos to replace the current ones (I hope so lol).
Recommended Posts