Tong Posted February 3, 2015 Posted February 3, 2015 CT Jin below CS1 Jin? CT Jin was an ok character. Decent normals, good damage and reliable oki/knockdown. But his options are rather limited outside certain ranges, his oki/knockdown is really easy to disrespect, the old Freeze mechanic (mash to escape) makes his Freeze stuff pretty weak for gimmicks/mixups. CS1 Jin surely does less (meterless) damage in general, but he can enforce pressure better (3C> 236C in the corner = Just neutral tech and block, anything else you will eat another combo), his normals are more versatile, his damage increases alot when he gets meter, which is not a problem for him because of how easily he builds meter, and the Freeze gimmicks/mixups are viable options for him now. He's a better character overall and much more capable than in CT. The reason why CS1 Jin wasnt upper/top tier was because the rest of the characters have gotten ridiculously strong in CS1 (and most CT characters were poorly made).
StylisH Posted February 3, 2015 Posted February 3, 2015 So what's you guys most annoying version of Hazama =^_^= CSE. TK Hirentotsu loop was perhaps the most obnoxious thing I've seen in a fighting game, and that covers a hell of a lot of ground.
Putin Posted February 3, 2015 Posted February 3, 2015 It was hard midscreen though so nobody did more than a couple of loops Most fun Hazama to play AS would be CSEX for me, because that's when he got the best chains plus actual setups in the corner, Gasshou wallbounce ender was great ;-;
Errol Posted February 3, 2015 Posted February 3, 2015 CT Jin was an ok character. Decent normals, good damage and reliable oki/knockdown. But his options are rather limited outside certain ranges, his oki/knockdown is really easy to disrespect, the old Freeze mechanic (mash to escape) makes his Freeze stuff pretty weak for gimmicks/mixups. CS1 Jin surely does less (meterless) damage in general, but he can enforce pressure better (3C> 236C in the corner = Just neutral tech and block, anything else you will eat another combo), his normals are more versatile, his damage increases alot when he gets meter, which is not a problem for him because of how easily he builds meter, and the Freeze gimmicks/mixups are viable options for him now. He's a better character overall and much more capable than in CT. The reason why CS1 Jin wasnt upper/top tier was because the rest of the characters have gotten ridiculously strong in CS1 (and most CT characters were poorly made). I'm going on the assumption of lists being relative to the game. CS2 Rachel is stronger than EX Rachel (3f guard point cat chair ->8k), but relative to the rest of the cast, EX Rachel wins.
mAc Chaos Posted February 3, 2015 Posted February 3, 2015 I like the idea of comparing their absolute strengths; we never see that happen.
Tong Posted February 3, 2015 Posted February 3, 2015 I'm going on the assumption of lists being relative to the game. CS2 Rachel is stronger than EX Rachel (3f guard point cat chair ->8k), but relative to the rest of the cast, EX Rachel wins. Well, if we're just comparing their tier placements on each game then it's pretty easy to rank them. But if we're talking about each character strengths and weaknesses on each game, then it's not so simple! lol
RWA Announcer Posted February 3, 2015 Posted February 3, 2015 Litherain-XIII's already covered Noel better than I ever could, so I'll move on to my other characters. Azrael: Didn't get a whole of time with 1.0, since I waited for U.S. release due to Graduate School, but I liked LK's analogy of calling him a stronger Kanji, because while I've NEVER played a grappler character before, outside of dabbling with Hakan (and don't plan to start anytime soon, because I just don't like being slow and inactive,) I always thought that his unique, Slayer-esque, Teleport dashes, combined with stubby, inconsistent normal, was what the "Grappler Struggle" would be like. 1.1 is obviously his most powerful version, as he's Top 5 (I refuse to believe he's better than Carl,) due to all of his bad matchups being nerfed and his handful of Quality Of Life improvements. However, I've always appreciated that he tows the line of balance, despite being strong, because if you look at all the charts, LK had him right on the line in 1.0, Dora has him in Top 3, but also right on the line in 1.1, while the East/West Lists had him slightly to the side of "Has Faults." As for his future, I'm VERY optimistic, his core is intact, the new corner game looks BRUTAL, and the buffs to Gustav and Instant Phalanx were the only things I ever wanted, and are worth the loss of Growler IMO, since he still has his health and backdash. He still seems like he can hang with everyone, has no true hard counters, and while he's getting kicked out of the penthouse, he's dragging his biggest threat (Koko) down with him, and feasting oh her flesh, and if Hazama, Carl and Valk are his biggest annoyances, (and mine!) then that's O.K. Kokonoe: I can compare them, but do I really need to? She's definitely worse in 2.0, but outside of forced resource management, I think she'll be O.K., even though, like Rachel, Gravitrons ARE this character, so we'll see how she develops, since, even if they're weaker, all of her tools are still present in her kit for the most part. I have faith that if anyone can salvage her remains, it's going to be Matoi and BananaKen though. Lamda-11: My memory's pretty fuzzy on her since it's been so many years, so I'd like somebody with more knowledge, like my man BloodWolf, to come help me out. I didn't spend a lot of time with her EXTEND version, and I liked her CSII version okay, but I feel like her CS1 incarnation was the most well-equipped, even though she always hovered around that A-B Rank, save for Satoshi putting her in S in EXTEND, but I recall someone here calling her "The most balanced character in Blazblue," it may have been Xie, and I always appreciated that. Makoto: I honestly don't remember enough about CS1 Mak, outside of the Parry Loop to compare her to her CSII version, in terms of which one may have been absolutely better, but I'm looking forward to her seemingly returning to form in 2.0.
Zedar90 Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Famitsu article about the "My Room" feature in Player Match.
Tokkan Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 http://www.famitsu.com/news/201502/05070965.html Player Match has a new feature called "My Room". It's a... well, it's a customisable room. And now Player Match looks similar to online lobbies. Apparently this weeks Famitsu magazine has more info. Edit: More info. Team Matches are back in CP Extend. The last and only BB to have them was CS Extend. It's in Red VS White format, with a red team and a blue team. There are 8 Gag Stories (Terumi, Azrael, Bullet, Kokonoe, Celica, Lambda, Relius, Amane). Terumi's gag story is about him starting a band.
skd Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Valk has always been tha gawd. He has gotten more difficult to dominate with every new iteration, but he was already a monster to deal with as it was, so it's not like he didn't have it coming. Izayoi has just gotten better from CP. She still has a ways to go, but from what I've seen of 2.0, she will be a real problem. I'm still of the belief that she could use some help gaining stocks in bad MUs (Tao, Valk, Arakune) but it seems she can rock with anyone now. Ginger Chick for president. i just wanted to stress that in 1.1, she is really strong. like, really really strong. like, IMO Top 5 strong. Undeniably a "real problem" already. Also arakune? i dont think any of those matchups are bad for her, to be honest :> Arakune actually feels like a good match for her. Like, there is actually no reasonable way i can see it as a bad matchup haha
Luminos564 Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 There are 8 Gag Stories (Terumi, Azrael, Bullet, Kokonoe, Celica, Lambda, Relius, Amane). Terumi's gag story is about him starting a band. Oh shit, he's gone all Poison on us . I am not sure why we'd need custom rooms for Player Matches. But I suppose they need to give us options to spend all that in-game money on something (assuming this is what they intend to do). Ever since Extend, I found that after a while, there really is nothing left to spend it on.
swordsman09 Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 I am not sure why we'd need custom rooms for Player Matches. But I suppose they need to give us options to spend all that in-game money on something (assuming this is what they intend to do). Ever since Extend, I found that after a while, there really is nothing left to spend it on. Games are trying more to use Soul Calibur V's lobby system. Soul Calibur technically had lobbyception too. I'm pretty sure DOA4 had a "My Room" like this as well.
BloodWolF Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Lamda-11: My memory's pretty fuzzy on her since it's been so many years, so I'd like somebody with more knowledge, like my man BloodWolf, to come help me out. I didn't spend a lot of time with her EXTEND version, and I liked her CSII version okay, but I feel like her CS1 incarnation was the most well-equipped, even though she always hovered around that A-B Rank, save for Satoshi putting her in S in EXTEND, but I recall someone here calling her "The most balanced character in Blazblue," it may have been Xie, and I always appreciated that. If I remember correctly, the main change to CSII was that gravity seed lost its invulnerability. That reduced her tools a little, but she still had plenty of potential for pressure throughout CS with her long sickle storm oki (not to mention destroying guard primers with everything). She hovered around dead center in the tiers, which was a nice speculation of balance. Later in CP, she was considered one of the most honest and balanced by some because her gameplan was obvious, her drawbacks were obvious, she had no tricks or gimmicks, and it was all really in the hands of the player to make her work the way she was meant to. This is one of the reasons I really loved CP Nu more than any other iteration. I had a few matches to play around with CP2 Lambda about a month ago (due to Errol's recommendation) and the main thing that I saw as a drawback was the automatic second drive. I felt it really restricted my options in movement and pressure in general. I'll, of course, play her on the side with Nu and see what happens when the new version hits in a few months.
Errol Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 CS1 is her worst iteration, she didn't have sickle storm oki until CS2 I believe.
VermilionBird Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 DOA4's custom lobbies were the entire reason behind its incredible lag. Most likely won't be the same because the lobbies in DOA4 were in depth, 3D and nearly 10 years old.
zaeris Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 CS1 is her worst iteration, she didn't have sickle storm oki until CS2 I believe. Isnt that the same version she had to crescent saber loop and gravity dp?
Errol Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Isnt that the same version she had to crescent saber loop and gravity dp? Doesn't matter. Yeah she had gravity DP, but it was slow startup so easily OS'd. and she had crescent loops, although difficult could do a lot of damage. But lots of characters had explosive damage in CS1 and she had bad matchups vs S characters in that game (e.g. Bang)
BloodWolF Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 I forgot about the Crescent loops. Those were fun. Thanks for the clarification Errol. Bang was a monster that iteration..and he's always been a bad MU for us due to his tools.
Airk Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Actually, this should be good for discussion; what do you guys think of your characters across all of the versions? And no, this isn't to bitch about how much they currently suck, I just want something to talk about and an opinion of who everyone plays. Haha, this is so easy for Tsubaki: CT=S Tier! CS1=Awful, but with some interesting ideas. CS2=Surprisingly decent, but minus most of the interesting ideas. CSE=Weak CP=Weak CP2=Weak Each time she's been weak she's been weak because of the same basic reasons while they shuffle around trading a bunch of random crap that doesn't really help her win for a different bunch of random crap that doesn't really help her win. It should be no surprise that the last time she was decent was also the last time she had decent normals. They keep switching around how easy it is to get charge and just how useless her charge moves are, rather than stepping back and evaluating how they actually want the character to like, work.
TekkamanArk Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Haha, this is so easy for Tsubaki: CT=S Tier! Tsubaki wasn't in CT. What is this?
Airk Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Tsubaki wasn't in CT. What is this? She was in story mode! :P (PSST! It's a joke. Tsubaki has never been good)
Narroo Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Haha, this is so easy for Tsubaki: CT=S Tier! CS1=Awful, but with some interesting ideas. CS2=Surprisingly decent, but minus most of the interesting ideas. CSE=Weak CP=Weak CP2=Weak Each time she's been weak she's been weak because of the same basic reasons while they shuffle around trading a bunch of random crap that doesn't really help her win for a different bunch of random crap that doesn't really help her win. It should be no surprise that the last time she was decent was also the last time she had decent normals. They keep switching around how easy it is to get charge and just how useless her charge moves are, rather than stepping back and evaluating how they actually want the character to like, work. But that begs the question "Why?" They can't be completely oblivious. They've been working on the game for years and video game fans, god knows, never shut up.
Kiba Posted February 4, 2015 Posted February 4, 2015 Haha, this is so easy for Tsubaki: CT=S Tier! CS1=Awful, but with some interesting ideas. CS2=Surprisingly decent, but minus most of the interesting ideas. CSE=Weak CP=Weak CP2=Weak Each time she's been weak she's been weak because of the same basic reasons while they shuffle around trading a bunch of random crap that doesn't really help her win for a different bunch of random crap that doesn't really help her win. It should be no surprise that the last time she was decent was also the last time she had decent normals. They keep switching around how easy it is to get charge and just how useless her charge moves are, rather than stepping back and evaluating how they actually want the character to like, work. CS1 Tsubaki was the worst. Remember here that this was the version where IB'ing something made it 5 frames? worse? So Tsubaki literally got poked out of everything, or alternatively IB > DP. She didn't really have decent ways to inflict pressure. 2B > 2D was unsafe on IB and you could get a CH on her. 6BB was also pretty useless, very slow startup and heavily negative on block. Air enders seemed to be a big thing in CS1, and she couldn't even get oki from it unless she used the D version. With CP they helped to elevate some of the problems. She gets better oki from j.214X and she has a projectile she can use for disruption. I know she still has the negative parts but I'm not looking at them so much because in the end you've just gotta work with what she has y'know. I slightly disagree that Tsubaki is weak in CP. CS1 yeah, not CP. Can't comment much for CP2 but all I can say is that the nerf to her rekka ender oki will hurt her. Not gonna get into this a great bunch though since I know how Tsubaki talk can get in here.
Airk Posted February 5, 2015 Posted February 5, 2015 Tsubaki is pretty decent in CP2. I'm not really seeing the magic; Also, this is what everyone says every time a new version comes out, and then people play for a while and the official diagnosis ends up being "C-tier again." so you'll forgive my skepticism. They always seem to do some strange two steps forward, two steps back dance with her by nerfing stuff that doesn't need to be nerfed. I mostly agree with Kiba - if it wasn't clear, "Awful" is worse than "Weak" which is just "Not really as good as most of the rest of the cast" as opposed to "Outright bad." As for why she's weak, at this point, I have no idea. Building a character whose schtick is "Build up a special gauge, then get in and apply pressure" but whose special gauge neither helps her get in nor helps her apply pressure, and who has otherwise below average pressure tools just doesn't seem to add up. I'm pretty sure they just don't know what to do, which is why every incarnation changes around a bunch of stuff (Extend Tsubaki was supposed to be all about the install super!) Anyway, that's that. </Tsubaki>
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