nstalkie Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 I've been to a BB:CS tournament in France last weekend. The turnout was low, which I already expected before going there. Only 4 people entered. The small turnout in tournaments is to be expected in Europe ofcourse, because the game ain't out yet. But in Belgium for example, it's not popular at all. I know only 1 other dustloop member from Belgium and only one guy who plays (still CT, but he's going to buy CS) that I met on justin.tv. However there was also a free tournament for girls for which the turnout was good (14 girls entered). They could use beginner mode if they wanted. Afterwards, the tournament organizer told me that he would probably allow beginner mode in their regular tournaments as well in order to get a higher number of entries and to lower the bar a bit for people who wanted to get into the game. I don't know anything about beginner mode, so my question is: what is the general opinon on allowing beginner mode in tournaments ? Remember, this is not like a major tournament, just a small one. The goal is to get more people into playing BB:CS. Is beginner mode abusable ? broken ? From my first look at it during the tournament, it seemed like the combos that happen in beginner mode are pretty punishable, so I'm guessing it's not really a thing to be concerned about.
Tofma Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 (edited) i dont see any problems. theres a bunch of stuff that you cant do with beginner mode like -bang otg 2b>623b d6c -bang 5a -bang 2b outside of combos stuff like that afaik you cant even burst in beginner mode Edited November 23, 2010 by Tofma
TheGreatReptar Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 Beginner mode only gives you access to like half of your character's moveset, forces you to barrier block everything, distortions have a charge up time, and you can't burst. The only thing that stupid is that Tager can do standing 720s (although it's possible to do them anyway). A half-competent player can beat someone using beginner mode, so it really shouldn't be a problem. I could see people raging if they lose to a beginner mode player, but that's about the only problem I could see.
RaveSage Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 Someone told me on youtube (forgot who and what vid) that beginner mode is allowed at Japanese tournaments. I see no problem with allowing it other than it might discourage the American scene to actually learn the game. Which means an overall weaker player base blah blah free ect. On the other hand, tournament organizers can get more revenue by allowing it. I just hope nobody gets salty when they get comments like...
St1ckBuG Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 If all you're concerned about is beginner mode being broke, then you have nothing to worry about.
Manta Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 I remember dicking around in beginner mode and using it to demonstrate some basic combos, helped a bit.
unsanctifier Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 A tournament is usually for those who are at a higher level of the game. There is a technical aspect to it and beginner mode limits yourself and shows that you haven't really learned the game. In proper tournaments, beginner mode should be banned without a shadow of a doubt, but it fun random tournaments it doesn't really matter does it? Especially if you're just trying to get people to play.
evilben Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 the major reason why you will not lose to beginner mode is that it is way predictable. the person has one button for *attack* and if they mash it they get the same combo over and over again. makes it very easy to know when to reversal it.
TheGreatReptar Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 A tournament is usually for those who are at a higher level of the game. There is a technical aspect to it and beginner mode limits yourself and shows that you haven't really learned the game. In proper tournaments, beginner mode should be banned without a shadow of a doubt, but it fun random tournaments it doesn't really matter does it? Especially if you're just trying to get people to play. Banning it in theory would only exclude some people from entering a tournament, which people who use beginner mode are really just free money. I say let them enter for nothing more than to inflate the pot for the tournament. They'll hopefully learn they're doing something wrong and play like a normal person before long.
SimpleKiss Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 A tournament is usually for those who are at a higher level of the game. There is a technical aspect to it and beginner mode limits yourself and shows that you haven't really learned the game. In proper tournaments, beginner mode should be banned without a shadow of a doubt, but it fun random tournaments it doesn't really matter does it? Especially if you're just trying to get people to play. To me, this is really fucking stupid. If beginner mode adds more people to a tournament? Shit, more free money to the pot, IMO.
Silius Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 Allowing BM in regular tournaments isn't a problem at all, since it severely limits that players options. But people shouldn't really enter tournaments with BM, since it pretty much guarantees a loss against (most) experienced players. But a BM tournament could potentially be a good idea.
RaveSage Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 To me, this is really fucking stupid. If beginner mode adds more people to a tournament? Shit, more free money to the pot, IMO. Isn't that sort of the point? How is that a bad thing? People get drawn in by the ability to use beginner mode. Then if they like the game and eventually decide to get better, there's one more player who starts learning the game for real. It's just a stepping stone for people who might be intimidated by the mechanics or something. Top players have nothing to lose.
Manta Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 You're shafting yourself choosing it, so banning people from using it would be like banning people from choosing Rachel and Tsubaki because they're hamstringing themselves to do so. Heck, winning whilst using it at high end level of play is actually meta-awesome.
Andarel Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 Considering beginner mode is generally soft-banned, it's not really a big deal. Good players won't use it, bad players who wouldn't win anyways can use it as a crutch to do flashy stuff and add free money to the pot. Considering the massive disadvantages Beginner Mode gives (even like beginner Tager with 1-button 720 and no AC combos), why should we stop people from lowering their chances of winning?
mAc Chaos Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 The reason it's usually discouraged is that it creates a new hurdle of a new player to get over. Instead of just learning how to play, they'll have to unlearn everything they picked up from beginner mode on top of it. It doesn't pose a competitive problem, it's just not in their long term interest as far as development goes.
Eshi Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 The reason it's usually discouraged is that it creates a new hurdle of a new player to get over. Instead of just learning how to play, they'll have to unlearn everything they picked up from beginner mode on top of it. It doesn't pose a competitive problem, it's just not in their long term interest as far as development goes.I would argue that giving new blood incentive to go to a tournament and be exposed to high level play is definitely in their developmental interest. Especially considering how niche the tournament scene is for Blazblue.
Blade Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 As far as tournament play goes, it's not that I'm against it, but if the tournament was announced far in advance and the right people were notified, that sort of thing just shouldn't happen logistically. If it was a pick-up tournament I could understand, or if it was Celebrities playing (lol VAs playing BB suck). My personal feelings regarding beginner mode are these: --If a normally "good" player uses Beginner Mode to go easy on you, he's trolling (this is doubly true if he wins). --Certain complex characters (Litchi/Hazama/Carl/Arakune maybe) actually benefit to some extent to the mode, and if the person is both familiar with the nuances of the way Beginner Mode works AND how they combo naturally (i.e. shifting from a ground combo to air combo or something similar, or charging the Distortion Drive move DURING a combo), they can be something of a threat to medium or moderate players if played "correctly". Beginner Mode should be used primarily for introducing the game, not actual learning of it (unless they are unfamiliar with fighting games in general, then you have to work them through the process).
KayEff Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 --Certain complex characters (Litchi/Hazama/Carl/Arakune maybe) actually benefit to some extent to the mode, and if the person is both familiar with the nuances of the way Beginner Mode works AND how they combo naturally (i.e. shifting from a ground combo to air combo or something similar, or charging the Distortion Drive move DURING a combo), they can be something of a threat to medium or moderate players if played "correctly". Actually, only Tager benefits off of Beginner mode. Ask someone who's played him using beginner mode and you'll see why.
CakeWasBannedd Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 like i said to kurushii in the early days when he thought he was a hilarious troll for using beginner mode litchi you're willingly detrimenting your ability to learn the game, it's a colossal waste of time. if you don't care about being good at the game, then by all means, play a fighting game casually.
xlolxlolx Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 Actually, only Tager benefits off of Beginner mode. Ask someone who's played him using beginner mode and you'll see why. i love trolling scrubs online with beginner mode tager
Kurushii Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 like i said to kurushii in the early days when he thought he was a hilarious troll for using beginner mode litchi you're willingly detrimenting your ability to learn the game, it's a colossal waste of time. if you don't care about being good at the game, then by all means, play a fighting game casually. Aren't you the cute little troll for bringing up something that was explained in the past and make yourself seem clean. You insulted and spammed multiple lines of communications with me Cake. It was JP BBCS with very little NA EC players on and I refused to relearn Haku from his changes so I dicked around with B.Mode until Makoto was released. Also it was all online play that I used B.Mode *gasp*. Since when was online matches serious against people all the way across the world with 1 bar connections? I played casually cause I spent too much time recording and bringing content to the communities so it wasn't a "colossal waste of time". Not like ANYONE covered the mode in Japan and I was one of the first to actually experiment with it. Is the mode worth it for all the disadvantages? Fuck no. Is it decent enough to make a casual player enjoy their play? Yes. Should it be legal for tournaments? No, unless they ban B.Tager. Overall Blade covered the facts.
soujiro seta Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 Yeah cake, kurushii's beginner mode antics were purely for lulz, which I personally enjoyed. With the way his beginner mode litchi wrecked JP online they probably thought he was Shounen, hahahaha
Hustle Man 77 Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 Beginner Mode. Not broken? No ban. If they want to limit themselves, who cares? If they're serious about the game in the first place, they'd eventually learn how to play the game. Why not build up the usually meager pots?
FunkyP Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 You can tell how much of a joke this game is when we start allowing beginner mode in tournaments to get more people. Blazblue could honestly be the next competitive brawl, and annoying little kids and super scrubs will start showing up to tournaments thinking they're hot shit. Then the rest the FG community starts giving you shit about your players and community. Oh wait thats already happened...
Blade Posted November 23, 2010 Posted November 23, 2010 You can tell how much of a joke this game is when we start allowing beginner mode in tournaments to get more people. Blazblue could honestly be the next competitive brawl, and annoying little kids and super scrubs will start showing up to tournaments thinking they're hot shit. Then the rest the FG community starts giving you shit about your players and community. Oh wait thats already happened... Clearly you've never been beaten in TVC by a kid half your age, FunkyP...with combos that would make you wince. The kid was 10, goddammit....and the only person who got close to beating him was his older brother who taught him how to play in the first place. *rant* Honestly I don't care one way or the other. I've used BM Ragna, I've fought and beaten BMUNL Ragna too...if you know how to play you can beat them, this goes double for people who actually know guard strings.
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