BBCS II Loctest Discussion ~not "Complaining"~

[Spirit Juice]

Here's a smart idea: someone should e-mail ASW and ask for a changes log, instead of actually GUESSING what the changes are.

A$W doesn't have time to listen to us; they're too busy rolling around in money to hear us.

[SimpleKiss]

theres is nuthing stragetic about jumping around and using is new sky poke. and it effectively gives everyone trouble because his weapon is not apart of his hitbox.not to mention him jumping super high and doing it.

also, a person mention his drives have long recovery, no they dont and for characters with poor range, tsubaki and rachel, punishing him whiffing drives can be a bit problematic depending on the distance whiffed. the links are not difficult, people are hitting this shit in horrible lag. hakumen is one of the easiest characters in the game to use effectively period. i can assure you, if hakumens players and rachel(good rachels) were to switch i bet you that hakumens would see how much more harder it is using rachel then hakumen.

You sound like you have no idea what the hell you're talking about. If hakumen whiffs a drive, unless it's 5D, you have a billion years to run up and throw him for free.

this shit's easy; that shit's easy. Everybody commentating on how easy a character they don't play is. Whatever though, Hakumen's combos are pretty easy. So are a lot of things in this game.

[Reioumu]

You don't have a source that says Makoto's j.CC was removed. Only changes that have been said are 5B and PC changes.

And apparently someone mentioned that CH j.B has a long untech time, though it's currently untechable until they hit the ground. That could be a change, but this is just mere speculation from the translations people have made.

[OmniSScythe]

You don't have a source that says Makoto's j.CC was removed. Only changes that have been said are 5B and PC changes.

And apparently someone mentioned that CH j.B has a long untech time, though it's currently untechable until they hit the ground. That could be a change, but this is just mere speculation from the translations people have made.

CH j.B already can be teched midair if done from high enough like say double jump height.

[Leonil_Requiem]

Hakumen's j.D has always been Special cancellable, even since CT.

[Seifuuku]

require special cancel to combo, most likely

[Blade]

Hakumen's j.D has always been Special cancellable, even since CT.

While that's true, only Hotaru would hit, but because it hit so high there was no way to combo followup (even the cancel timing was messed up), even though you could jump cancel, it was essentially a waste of two Magatama unless you were going for that last hit to K.O. Tsubaki would completely wiff as well.

Edit: It'd be nice if someone checked the hitbox/float properties of j.D this time around, see if Tsubaki actually works or if you CAN combo off Hotaru.

[mAc Chaos]

I don't get why they're nerfing Haku's counters... I guess they think, since you have to work to get in on him due to j.C and 4C, he shouldn't be that formidable defensively anymore? The 5D change in CS was more a nerf than a buff; sure it lasts longer but who cares, you can't counter off it. It just never made sense to me since you never saw a legion of Hakus destroying people with the D button. Then again half of their changes haven't made sense in the past so :P YO LETS NERF NOEL

Terrible. :P

[Blade]

About all j.D usually does for me in most high tension situations is keep me from being low-poked or swept anyway (well, it is a nice anti-throw move). 5D was only good for moves with long startup, like Carnage Scissors. It only could followup with Rachel (2A) anyway.

[SimpleKiss]

About all j.D usually does for me in most high tension situations is keep me from being low-poked or swept anyway (well, it is a nice anti-throw move). 5D was only good for moves with long startup, like Carnage Scissors. It only could followup with Rachel (2B) anyway.

I think you mean 2A. And why would you 5D carnage scissors? Just block the first part and then do whatever the fuck you want to him with a free counter hit combo afterwards.

[Blade]

Yeah, well it's a prime example of a slow-startup move (thanks for correcting me, again)...

[psycofang2]

they are nerfing his D button because every dumbass and their grandma thinks that as hakumen all they have to do is mash D in block strings to counter and mash C outside of blockstrings to win. the people who say learning haku is easy are somewhat correct and off by a long shot. combos are easy. WINNING isn't easy. especially when hakus shit always costs something.

[Blade]

That's funny cuz last I checked only 6D/2D works inbetween Guardstrings and only after IB. This is why I suggested they make a "Guard Action" in Training Mode (record an action immediately after block), so that people actually learn to fear Haku during Guardstrings after IB.

[psycofang2]

you have to understand the idiots who think haku is overpowered BELIEVE we win this way. mash D to win. we aren't NU, our C button is so unsafe its not funny. i wish hakus normals were like bangs, whiffing everything safely. give our 6C 5As properties we will be OP.

[SimpleKiss]

6D and 2D were actually buffed from CT, to CS, if that's what you guys are talking about. Well, Kinda. They gained some more active frames, and they prorate more so you get less damage from them. the CSII nerf to J.D doesn't bother me at all.

[mAc Chaos]

^I consider that a nerf.

Also I'm pretty sure the active frames weren't increased. They've always been 7 frames. Only 5D's was increased.

[SimpleKiss]

^I consider that a nerf.

Also I'm pretty sure the active frames weren't increased. They've always been 7 frames. Only 5D's was increased.

it's a wash I guess. I'm pretty sure they added like 2 frames to 6D and 2D. -shrug-

[Silfer]

Just to make sure I'm not missing something here; this is over now, and no one said anything at all about Mu?

It seems that 5c MIGHT be a bit faster and somewhat shorter, but nothing confirmed.

[Jason D.]

Regarding Hakumen's j.D not being combo-able anymore, I think they just wanted to give you a reason to use his other counters. Now, I'm not too wise on Hakumen's damage per combo, but I do know that a lot of people will do a just-off-the-ground j.D counter in EVERY opportunity when they want to counter. Why not? I mean, it'll go over lows, it's immune to throws, and it'll still counter anything that touches it. Beats almost anything. It's clearly superior. So why ever risk using a normal ground counter instead? Granted, maybe ground counters in CS1 can lead to more damage, I don't know. But point is, now, if you want to do the incredibly more safe j.D counter, you still can, but you're not going to get any damage. And if you want to take a risk with a ground counter, and actually read your opponent correctly, THEN you can get damage for it.

And for the record, I'm feeling the same way about Noel's 5D having less invincibility, assuming that's true. Right now a lot of people are just mashing it at every opportunity, just hoping that maybe it'll pass through something. Should that really be a good strategy for her? Randomly throw it out, and pray it works? Because it has a good chance of beating anything, even if she has no idea what their next move will actually be. So how about, instead, she actually has to read her opponent's next move correctly, and do the 5D with good timing.

[Alex073088]

^

sounds good to me on both characters =), it allows for the user of both to actually to think about what there doing.

[tolore]

The obvious reason to use the ground counters is that the jump counter has jump start up added to it, and frame 1 counters are a lot less impressive when they aren't actually frame 1.

[LordSpectreX]

Good luck trying to IB j.D during a ground blockstring too.

[whitevoid]

Regarding Hakumen's j.D not being combo-able anymore, I think they just wanted to give you a reason to use his other counters. Now, I'm not too wise on Hakumen's damage per combo, but I do know that a lot of people will do a just-off-the-ground j.D counter in EVERY opportunity when they want to counter. Why not? I mean, it'll go over lows, it's immune to throws, and it'll still counter anything that touches it. Beats almost anything. It's clearly superior. So why ever risk using a normal ground counter instead? Granted, maybe ground counters in CS1 can lead to more damage, I don't know. But point is, now, if you want to do the incredibly more safe j.D counter, you still can, but you're not going to get any damage. And if you want to take a risk with a ground counter, and actually read your opponent correctly, THEN you can get damage for it.

And for the record, I'm feeling the same way about Noel's 5D having less invincibility, assuming that's true. Right now a lot of people are just mashing it at every opportunity, just hoping that maybe it'll pass through something. Should that really be a good strategy for her? Randomly throw it out, and pray it works? Because it has a good chance of beating anything, even if she has no idea what their next move will actually be. So how about, instead, she actually has to read her opponent's next move correctly, and do the 5D with good timing.

By his "other counters" you should mean 5D. 6D and 2D are pretty much irreplaceable. But a good jD tends to be much better than 5D (notice that they buffed 5D a little bit).

On Noel, it's more that it's far from being anything that is a serious issue. There are plenty of things that character can do without, but I don't see any significant problems for balance reasons that would require such a nerf.

[mAc Chaos]

6D and 2D got a damage nerf and 5D doesn't combo anymore so you see j.D used more. It's not a matter of j.D being so good but the other counters not being as good anymore.

I'd imagine everything isn't that good anymore with Noel so they cling to the last thing they have left. :P They should give her better other things instead of nerfing it...

[LordSpectreX]

Well, scrubs think Noel is cheap. So she gets nerfed.

I mean, the invincibility is a pain sometimes, but it's far from cheap. But I doubt ASW care.